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Ukraine - Superthread

The Gepards seem to be doing stellar work.
Pity the CAF didn’t retain the dual Skyguard guns - I’m sure they could have been modified onto a variety of Medium Tactical Trucks, or LAV…

Makes one wonder if there is a potential role for a LAV-Skyguard variant using a Gepard’ish sort of turret.
Yup, seems like a great piece of kit. I’m thinking lowest level- something to take out the drones that are dropping single grenades or RPG rounds onto trenches or OPs. There needs to be platoon level light RPAS defense.
 
Yup, seems like a great piece of kit. I’m thinking lowest level- something to take out the drones that are dropping single grenades or RPG rounds onto trenches or OPs. There needs to be platoon level light RPAS defense.
Lots of war games coming out of UKR theatre LL. I suspect our Combined Arms BN’s down here are going to get much more combined shortly.
 
It seems like the 35mm are living up to their intent. Can the 25mm do the job can it do the job on a Bradley or LAV? The Bradley with the 25mm and TOW should be a welcome addition for the Ukrainians. Theres still lots of TOW available right?
 
It seems like the 35mm are living up to their intent. Can the 25mm do the job can it do the job on a Bradley or LAV? The Bradley with the 25mm and TOW should be a welcome addition for the Ukrainians. Theres still lots of TOW available right?
The 25mm is a fantastic weapon, depending on ammunition it can chew up pretty much anything. I don’t suspect that UKR will get APFSDS-DU rounds (a U.S. only item) though so killing the T-80 and T-90’s frontally isn’t going to occur easily. But standard APFSDS will make a mess out of most T-72 and earlier tanks. Plus HEI-T will just wreck any light vehicles and troops.

TOW-2B are plentiful and while a wire guided system that requires the gunner to be stationary and guide the missile in, it has a top attack mode as well so one can fly over the tank and punch through the roof.
OS range of 4.5km, but the longest distance I know of a successful TOW engagement from a Bradley is slightly over 5.2km

One of the biggest bonuses to the Bradley is the Fire Control, the thermal sights and LRF will allow very selective targeting — right now nothing Ukraine has is even close to the degree of capability that the Bradley offers.
 
The 25mm is a fantastic weapon, depending on ammunition it can chew up pretty much anything. I don’t suspect that UKR will get APFSDS-DU rounds (a U.S. only item) though so killing the T-80 and T-90’s frontally isn’t going to occur easily. But standard APFSDS will make a mess out of most T-72 and earlier tanks. Plus HEI-T will just wreck any light vehicles and troops.

TOW-2B are plentiful and while a wire guided system that requires the gunner to be stationary and guide the missile in, it has a top attack mode as well so one can fly over the tank and punch through the roof.
OS range of 4.5km, but the longest distance I know of a successful TOW engagement from a Bradley is slightly over 5.2km

One of the biggest bonuses to the Bradley is the Fire Control, the thermal sights and LRF will allow very selective targeting — right now nothing Ukraine has is even close to the degree of capability that the Bradley offers.
Yup. Ukraine already had a lot of ability to ‘hit’ and ‘kill’. More ‘see’ (attached to the other two) will be a great add.
 
I'm wondering about the possibility of Airburst 25mm ammunition for the Bushmaster.




Or maybe you just swap out the pintle mount for the C16 with an FCS13 RE?



 

And the Christmas gifts keep coming for Ukraine!
It would be interesting to know how much work is going on at Sierra and other army depots to bring kit from long term storage to operational state.
 
It would be interesting to know how much work is going on at Sierra and other army depots to bring kit from long term storage to operational state.
Agreed.
Even more interesting it seems that those A6’s and Bradley’s are coming out of POMCUS depots in Europe, so basically current versions (in the A6 case warstock that hadn’t gone to be refit to A7, and A3 Bradley’s that hadn’t yet gone through reset to A4).
If that holds true, it seems that if Abrams go from us to UKR they will also be M1A2 SepV2/3 tanks.
 
It seems as though Putin's nuclear threat has dissolved and the west has less apprehension with supplying Ukraine with more modern weapons. I wonder if China and India have placed the No Nukes condition on their support for Russia and the west knows it?
 
It seems as though Putin's nuclear threat has dissolved and the west has less apprehension with supplying Ukraine with more modern weapons. I wonder if China and India have placed the No Nukes condition on their support for Russia and the west knows it?

I think that most Russians know that the nuclear Sabre is better in its scabbard.
 
I think that most Russians know that the nuclear Sabre is better in its scabbard.
Putin is not "most Russians". The threat was used as the reason the west was reluctant to send modern weaponry from the outset. Most of the equipment sent was Soviet designed and built and it may be that there is few left to send, however, there is a creep towards more modern NATO equipment and in larger quantities. LAVs from Canada, Bradleys from the US, and Poland saying it would send it's Leopards once the Abrams arrive as well as Marders from Germany. Still not "top of the line" NATO equipment but creeping in that direction.
 
Agreed.
Even more interesting it seems that those A6’s and Bradley’s are coming out of POMCUS depots in Europe, so basically current versions (in the A6 case warstock that hadn’t gone to be refit to A7, and A3 Bradley’s that hadn’t yet gone through reset to A4).
If that holds true, it seems that if Abrams go from us to UKR they will also be M1A2 SepV2/3 tanks.

Out of POMCUS? THAT’s kind of a big deal, I think? That’s drawing down immediately available war stock.

Forgot to ask earlier- 25mm; is there much real armour penetration difference between APFSDS-DU vs APFSDS-T? Or does US just not use or stock the latter much because they have DU?
 
Performance difference depends on the density of the metal used in the standard round. The more dense the metal, the better its penetration will be.
 
Performance difference depends on the density of the metal used in the standard round. The more dense the metal, the better its penetration will be.
Tungsten’s slightly more dense in raw chemistry I think, but I know just enough to know I barely know shit and there’s probably much more to it.
 
Tungsten’s slightly more dense in raw chemistry I think, but I know just enough to know I barely know shit and there’s probably much more to it.
Apparently DU rounds experience a shearing or ablation at the tip during penetration (basically sharpening themselves as they go) while tungsten mushrooms. This would give DU a bit of an advantage.

But, most KE penetrators lose ballistic stability when they make contact. This would reduce the DU’s advantage as both type of ammo would start to tumble.
 
Apparently DU rounds experience a shearing or ablation at the tip during penetration (basically sharpening themselves as they go) while tungsten mushrooms. This would give DU a bit of an advantage.

But, most KE penetrators lose ballistic stability when they make contact. This would reduce the DU’s advantage as both type of ammo would start to tumble.
That said there was a case in Iraq of a Bradley taking out a Iraqi T-72 with the 25mm, which shows that unupgraded tanks, without additional armour are very much going to have a bad day with Bradley in town. T-62's, older 72s and 80s likely will suffer heavy casualties
 
That said there was a case in Iraq of a Bradley taking out a Iraqi T-72 with the 25mm, which shows that unupgraded tanks, without additional armour are very much going to have a bad day with Bradley in town. T-62's, older 72s and 80s likely will suffer heavy casualties
You mean the ERA filled with old egg crates isn’t going to help RuAF armour? 😉
 
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