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Ukraine - Superthread

Czech_pivo

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As long as President Biden and the USG remains committed to helping Ukraine, and the Ukraine is still willing to fight - who cares what some Europeans etc think.

Right now as long as the Arsenal of Democracy remains in play turning over equipment and sending $, who gives two shits about France etc.

Poland and England are still committed hard - and that’s pretty much all you need, one as stop over and the other the transit border.

Maybe those weak knees European weasels should think about the last time the was a major war in Europe…
Macron would be speaking German if America hadn’t moved across the sea…


But Germany today announced sending tanks and IFV’s - so it’s really just Macron trying to play nice to Putin.

Everyone wants Putin gone - so buck up and enjoy the ride.
I don’t see an scenario where Poland walks away from the Ukraine. They are tied at the hip now and into the future over the next 3-10yrs. As long as the Tories are in power the UK will be apart of this mix, lose the next election and all bets are off.
 

KevinB

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I don’t see an scenario where Poland walks away from the Ukraine. They are tied at the hip now and into the future over the next 3-10yrs. As long as the Tories are in power the UK will be apart of this mix, lose the next election and all bets are off.
Agreed.
Ukrainian support against Russia is heavily bipartisan down here - so we have at least 2.5years of heavy support on our end.
 

KevinB

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I'd like to believe that's true but have seen nothing yet confirming it in any of the German papers (and they would be all over this)
I was listening to his speech yesterday - I’ll try to dig it up. Sounded like the previously mentioned Leo 1, Marder and Pz2000 are going to move East.
 

Czech_pivo

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Agreed.
Ukrainian support against Russia is heavily bipartisan down here - so we have at least 2.5years of heavy support on our end.
And Ronald must be spinning in the grave knowing that the ‘Evil Empire’ is now looked at by the Republicans as the ‘good guys’.
 

Czech_pivo

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I don’t think that’s a fair assessment. Sure some idiots in the party are clinging to some bizarre idea that Russia was provoked, but they are a small minority.
The tail wags the dog now my friend, in our current bizarro world, this is reality.
 

The Bread Guy

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I'd like to believe that's true but have seen nothing yet confirming it in any of the German papers (and they would be all over this)
Spotted some media earlier this week saying Leopards were going to the Czechs (so the Czechs can send T72s to UKR) ...
... and this on Leopards & Marders ...
... based on this from the World Socialist Web Site take ....
... with no details provided in this English summary from the DEU info-machine of the Thursday speech to the Bundestag
 

Kirkhill

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The tail wags the dog now my friend, in our current bizarro world, this is reality.

Pivo - that is one of the problems that we are dealing with. "The" Republicans, "The" Democrats, "The" Conservatives, "The" Liiberals are a lot more than the "True" believers identified by both themselves and their enemies. It is that very distinction that our mutual enemies have been fostering and promoting. And the parties themselves have been playing to that division because it gets fans/fanatics out into the streets to work for the party for free.

We don't need to play up the divisions. That has been Vlad's game all along and the game of the Comintern since 1921.

Let's try not to play their game. :)
 

KevinB

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Pivo - that is one of the problems that we are dealing with. "The" Republicans, "The" Democrats, "The" Conservatives, "The" Liiberals are a lot more than the "True" believers identified by both themselves and their enemies. It is that very distinction that our mutual enemies have been fostering and promoting. And the parties themselves have been playing to that division because it gets fans/fanatics out into the streets to work for the party for free.

We don't need to play up the divisions. That has been Vlad's game all along and the game of the Comintern since 1921.

Let's try not to play their game. :)
Bingo, look at who's supporting art extremes financially and on both sides.
Enemies try to weaken their opponents internally, and Russia has done a very good job of exploiting the fringe.
 

FJAG

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Spotted some media earlier this week saying Leopards were going to the Czechs (so the Czechs can send T72s to UKR) ...
... and this on Leopards & Marders ...
... based on this from the World Socialist Web Site take ....
... with no details provided in this English summary from the DEU info-machine of the Thursday speech to the Bundestag
Yup. Got those and you and @KevinB are right about Germany's direction. Saw those before but thought there might be something new very recently.

Funny isn't it how this war is being fought by old Cold War equipment (which might have been tweaked a bit)? We got rid of the C2 Leos over a decade ago and are now griping that the Leo2A4 is an ancient rust bucket and not good enough for combat - we need the A7. And yet we have no idea if the A7 or the M1A2 SEP 3 or 4 is any more survivable against an NLAW or Javelin than the Leo2 A4 or even the C2 was.

I reiterate that our policy of divesting older but serviceable equipment (and no, I don't want to keep stuff that's beyond economical repair) every time we get new equipment is problematic. Yes, there is a cost to maintaining it but when half of our army is not just underequipped, it's unequipped, that's a cost that needs to be borne.

🍻
 

Skysix

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Right now most Republican elected officials have seen which way the wind blows - and it’s heavily against Russia with the voters…
Yes. But heavily with Trump and his views if they want financial help in getting elected
 

The Bread Guy

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Yes. But heavily with Trump and his views if they want financial help in getting elected
And if memory serves, Trump wasn't all that keen on arming Ukraine during his tenure. Mind you, the Russian troops were only in the smaller occupied bits in the east @ that point.
 

TacticalTea

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As long as President Biden and the USG remains committed to helping Ukraine, and the Ukraine is still willing to fight - who cares what some Europeans etc think.

Right now as long as the Arsenal of Democracy remains in play turning over equipment and sending $, who gives two shits about France etc.

Poland and England are still committed hard - and that’s pretty much all you need, one as stop over and the other the transit border.

Maybe those weak knees European weasels should think about the last time the was a major war in Europe…
Macron would be speaking German if America hadn’t moved across the sea…


But Germany today announced sending tanks and IFV’s - so it’s really just Macron trying to play nice to Putin.

Everyone wants Putin gone - so buck up and enjoy the ride.
Sure makes one ashamed to carry a French name. At least it makes the white flag and surrender jokes easier to bear.

Glory to POLUKUS.
A warm and fuzzy feeling when one starts hearing things like ''Lend-Lease'', ''AUMF'' and ''coalition of the willing''. :giggle:
At both far ends.
1653328203375.png

When politicians make excuses for not sending modern main battle tanks and fighter jets to Ukraine:

 

ueo

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Right now most Republican elected officials have seen which way the wind blows - and it’s heavily against Russia with the voters…
Really, haven't seen much in the alleged free press. Sources?
 

KevinB

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Really, haven't seen much in the alleged free press. Sources?
I look at voting records - and constantly berate my fellow Republicans if they act like imbeciles ;)
Look at Ukraine aid sponsorship and the Lend Lease Sponsorship bills in House and Senate - bipartisan and heavily supported.

The news seems to take Russian money to pitch divisionism these days.
 
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