Tac Vest does not make the grade.

[Grunt_031]

-There was an officer participating who stated that he would be giving a presentation to the Commandant of the Infantry Corps regarding what presided during the trial.  At one point he asked me what I thought of this. (the load carriage jury)  I expressed my concern that, even though we are moving to a modular system, units will still try to force uniformity on soldiers.  I told him that soldiers will never stop buying kit, and that the beauty of a modular system is that now he doesn't have to buy an entire rig, just the pouches he prefers.  Modularity gives each soldier the ability to customize to increase his level of effectiveness and efficiency and that should not be stagnated or stunted by an inflexible directive from an out of touch chain of command.  He agreed with me, but stated that individual units chain of command would be responsible for policy's such as that.
-Some major flaws in our PPE were discussed.  I will not go into detail on an open forum, but they were disturbing.  What was more disturbing was the reaction from the pers from DLR and DRDC-Toronto.  The flaws discussed were not being addressed at the moment, and this seemed OK with them.  The flaws were serious, yet talked about by them in a very non-chalant manner, as though it was common knowledge and accetable to have these flaws present and to not be working to remedy them.  If anyone wants specifics, please feel free to PM me.  If a mod deems it acceptable to discuss fatal flaws in PPE, please advise and I will make my concerns clearer and more public.

We discussed this points with DLR and CLS after a ""Dog and Pony in Ottawa and Washington after our tour in 2002 and again through out the trials (FBES) Fort Benning Experimental Series 2004-2005. Regardless of what is choosen the PWGS will want a certain percentage of Canadian content. The CLS can direct whatever he wish but he cannot over rule the Treasury Board regulations. They can buy small qty without going thru them but large projects will have to go thru the process no matter how streamline it has become. And now with the economy, there is more of a push to keep the money within Canada. Grohmann Knife anyone.

If any of the "trial rigs" is Canadian made or content guess which one you are getting. An example is the wpn rails system. We had a number of excellent systems at the time but none had Canadian content except the triad. Guess which one was chosen.

Cloth the soldier program was a 80% solution of the persons trialed. Even with just including the CBT arms on this trial it will be a majority rule and there will be a percentage of the pers that will hate the item chosen and will want to use something different. You can't make everybody happy and CLS program was the premier example.

And on top of it all. If the people making the decisions have used or have preferences they will fight for a particular  piece of equipment.

A better solution would be to give a combat equipment allowance with a set of strict purchasing criteria for the soldiers and the soldier could buy their choice. It would be the responsibility of the individual to have backup set.

 

[dapaterson]

The CLS can direct whatever he wish but he cannot over rule the Treasury Board regulations.

and

A better solution would be to give a combat equipment allowance with a set of strict purchasing criteria for the soldiers and the soldier could buy their choice. It would be the responsibility of the individual to have backup set.

First quote explains why second quote will not happen.  Besides, allowances get bastardized and misunderstood - the old CUA being a prime example.

 

[McG]

Finally, was this jury aiming to identify a replacement for the Tacvest or simply something to augment that system by giving combat arms soldiers a better system and leaving the Tacvest for those who just need something to carry their stuff while they do other jobs (trucker, staff guy, gate guard, etc)?

The jury was identifying an interim load carriage system for on-going operations (Afghanistan).  ISSP will replace the TacVest, but (since it is the same staff for both ISSP & the interim load carriage) we should hope that any lessons gathered through the jury are carried over to ISSP.

There are some great systems in this list but my question is that if the money is going to come thru Public Works and Government Services Canada for them is that not going to limit it to the systems that have Canadian content.

This is a bit of an over-played bogeyman.  Canadian industry has successfully forced DND to compete requirements which were being sole-sourced outside of the country.  However, Canada has signed several international trade agreements which generally prevent us from mandating Canadian products (depending on dollar value).  For many military contracts we are able to demand IRBs (the winning contractor is obligated to spend an equal dollar value in Canada & this plan must be submitted as a component of the bid proposal).

Most don't think its worth it, so they just do up the quick forms and buy inferior Canadian stuff that the troops hate.

You are out to lunch.

...And now with the economy, there is more of a push to keep the money within Canada. Grohmann Knife anyone.

That was just a company being whinny because they felt entitled to the contract and failed to bid competitively (apparently a not uncommon thing with companies that are long-standing incumbents to contracts).  The other knife was also Canadian & built to the DND specification.  It was better priced and it won.

 

[MikeL]

Even if the CF just comes out an allows troops to buy rigs from certain companies an be able to wear them in training an deployment I'd be happy, even if I don't get an allowance.  I dropped a bit of money on a chest rig an a better backpack an helmet pads before going on tour, no problem. All the extra money you get on tour more than covers it.

Pretty much what already happens in some units.. but the higher ups ie JTFA Commander/RSM can still squash it.


Would be cool though if the Canex did become like the US PXs and actually sold some good boots, pouches, etc.

 

[Mars79]

Instead of an allowance to the troops to buy combat equipment why not a work related refund when you do your taxes? 

 

[George Wallace]

Instead of an allowance to the troops to buy combat equipment why not a work related refund when you do your taxes?

A tax excemption much like what Tradesmen and Contractors claim for the purchase of new tools?  That would then classify us as "Journeymen". 

 

[Bzzliteyr]

A tax excemption much like what Tradesmen and Contractors claim for the purchase of new tools?  That would then classify us as "Journeymen".

And that is a bad thing?  The point of that post was...?  I would love to see tax exemptions in Canada for all Military pers.  Correct me if I am wrong, but isn't the US military tax free?  I remember seeing all kinds of sweet BMWs and nice rides when I was in Bliss.  They actually have an advantage.  Something like that could help recruiting as well...

RCR Grunt.  It's too bad I didn't get to that working group.  I have personal input on a mini rig I wore in the turret during most of the tour.  It worked for me but I weigh a mere 140lbs and can slink through the turret with no issues.  The "bigger" boys would have serious issues.

 

[OldSolduer]

I have a novel idea:

Why not just issue the proper kit?

Yeah I know.....its just my old dinosaur sense kicking in. Sorry.

 

[Matt_Fisher]

And that is a bad thing?  The point of that post was...?  I would love to see tax exemptions in Canada for all Military pers.  Correct me if I am wrong, but isn't the US military tax free?  I remember seeing all kinds of sweet BMWs and nice rides when I was in Bliss.  They actually have an advantage.  Something like that could help recruiting as well...

Bit of a hijack here, but to clarify things for Bzz:
Members of the US military pay federal and state income tax just as civilians do, however active duty members of the US military can elect to claim residency in any state of their choosing, so many will use Delaware or Florida are their state's of residency (regardless of where they're really from or currently residing), as those places have no state income tax.

When you're posted overseas on an operational tour in theatre, then you become tax exempt at both the federal and state levels.

 

[Loachman]

http://www.specopsbrand.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductID=40

"OVER-ARMOR SPEC.-OPS. Brand™ vest  fits waist size up to 54"
"OVER-ARMOR SPEC.-OPS. Brand™ vest  with the addition of Extender Panels fits waist size up to 70".

SEVENTY inch waist?

 

[PMedMoe]

"OVER-ARMOR SPEC.-OPS. Brand™ vest  fits waist size up to 54"
"OVER-ARMOR SPEC.-OPS. Brand™ vest  with the addition of Extender Panels fits waist size up to 70".

SEVENTY inch waist?

It will be our new BMI program.  ;D

 

[OldSolduer]

"OVER-ARMOR SPEC.-OPS. Brand™ vest  fits waist size up to 54"
"OVER-ARMOR SPEC.-OPS. Brand™ vest  with the addition of Extender Panels fits waist size up to 70".

SEVENTY inch waist?

70"?????

 

[Old Sweat]

I have envisaged two uses for a 70" inch diameter tac vest. The printable one is the up-armoured immersion heater.

 

[daftandbarmy]

I have envisaged two uses for a 70" inch diameter tac vest. The printable one is the up-armoured immersion heater.

That's so we can equip the Home Guard when the New York militia finally gets it's act together and invades us like a real army should.

 

[brihard]

I have envisaged two uses for a 70" inch diameter tac vest. The printable one is the up-armoured immersion heater.

It's more PC-ness. The federal government doesn't want to have to answer for why we aren't inclusive to airsofters.

 

[2 Cdo]

It's more PC-ness. The federal government doesn't want to have to answer for why we aren't inclusive to airsofters.

That photo is my wallpaper here at work with the by-line "Don't worry, I'm from the internet"  ;D

 

[Loachman]

It's a commercial company. They are market-driven, not "PC"-driven.

They are producing them in that size because they foresee sufficient sales for them in that size.

 

[brihard]

It's a commercial company. They are market-driven, not "PC"-driven.

They are producing them in that size because they foresee sufficient sales for them in that size.

It was an internet pop culture reference.  Have you not seen the photo of the immensely tubby airsofter with all the gucci kit?

 

[Loachman]

Yup.

 

[daftandbarmy]

I'm just happy that the guy in the background has a 1 PARA DZ flash on his smock. Excellent piss taking material!  :stirpot: