Staffing PRes Summer IT (From: Cutting the CF/DND HQ bloat)

[McG]

My suggestion let the reserve units run their own battle school (dp1). This keeps some units from always getting dinged to do centralized training; and the reg units train them to the standard pre deployment.

There are fixed costs (including manpower) that come with running courses.  Decentralizing courses may save units "getting dinged to do centralized training" but the fact is that more smaller courses will actually cause more work across the PRes as units get "dinged" to provide the 1-of Crse O, Crse WO and Admin NCO for every at or below min-load course going.

... why not refrain from worrying about "standards" ...

Because that would be absolutely stupid.  Without standards, we (the Army) can have no idea of what has been trained & what guys actually know.  A Cpl from the Buckshot Fusiliers would be wildly different in comparison to a Cpl from the Kootney Highlanders, and as an institution we would have no idea what to expect.  Should we choose to "refrain from worrying" about standards, then PRes IT would become an elaborate means of throwing away money. 

Do not confuse the Reg-Res training delta as a deviation of standards.  The delta is consciously built into the standard so that the PRes is not burdened with training unnecessary or unsustainable skillsets.  If the training burden is to be eased, maintaining standards and widening the delta is a potential option.

 

[Jarnhamar]

There isn't a very big difference between Pte/cpls in the reserves and Pte/cpls in the regular force, at least as far as the typical infantry soldier goes. I would suggest reserves have the edge on morale.

From the horror stories I've heard of Meaford and how staff are treated I personally would not want to go there.


There are a bunch of reasons why the general consensus is "I'll teach anywhere but Meaford". If the cf or whomever want to fix the reserve teaching issue in Meaford then go up there speak to the instructors that ARE there and you'll begin to understand why no one wants to instruct there.

 

[Petard]

This year seems to be especially bad for Meaford
I've eaten at Gagetown and Meaford's mess facilities, Meaford is far worse.
But below are some thoughts on what might help increase RST attendance, marginally, and something to consider WRT training delta's (which affect duration of RST courses)

Something that might make a few more staff, and possibly some students as well, more available, is to not run CT events in April and May. These events burn up the available time these folks can get away for any type of training, and frankly I don't see the value in these spring CT events.
Running a CT then inevitably has a significant part of the unit's leadership missing because a) they took an RST task and are at an ATC getting crse ready  or b) took an RST task but can only get so much time away and so are holding off taking it until the summer. Consequently the CT event in Apr and May has a low turn out, and does not have the bulk of the PTA it seeks so why do them? If they're intended to be work up training for an August concentration, I would say the August Ex then is probably a bit too ambitious.

This year, there's one other factor somewhat unique to LFCA meeting RST tasks: all these 1812 tasks. I've seen the priority go to RST first, which is as it should be, but then seen one message after another for 1812 bicentennial events too, all stressing their importance. These might be seen as jammy goes, ordinarily, but they do require fill. Fill RST first? Sure, but if they don't go, they can't be forced. With these 1812 tasks this summer having the importance they do, I'm not surprised to see some people that turned down RST show up for the 1812 ones.

As for training delta and what level to train to: for the artillery, because of the increased responsibilities to actually FG more capabilities without increase of PY, an entire gun Bty per Regt was converted to STA, FSCC, and observer tasks. This has meant, within ea area, P Res Arty units are to FG, and sustain, a Gun Bty for the Reg F Arty Regt in their area. Even with a 7+ month lead time, the technical skill sets are already wide apart, and getting wider with digitization. Reducing the IT time to make the RST more doable is not helping close that gap.

For P Res Arty units I think they should focus on IT more, some CT as a formed Bty, preferably within a Reg F CT event context (by the way, 2 RCHA has been trying to get this lined up this year, but timing was out of sync, but perhaps next year)

 

[Ostrozac]

within ea area, P Res Arty units are to FG, and sustain, a Gun Bty for the Reg F Arty Regt in their area. Even with a 7+ month lead time, the technical skill sets are already wide apart, and getting wider with digitization. Reducing the IT time to make the RST more doable is not helping close that gap.

For P Res Arty units I think they should focus on IT more, some CT as a formed Bty, preferably within a Reg F CT event context (by the way, 2 RCHA has been trying to get this lined up this year, but timing was out of sync, but perhaps next year)

The force generation of complete batteries of tube artillery is certainly extremely ambitious, both from an individual and a collective level. What are the guns and prime movers that the reserve artillery are training on? Is it M777 and HLVW? Are the guns dispersed among armories, or are the reservists travelling on weekends? Pet and Shilo certainly have some major travel issues involved for reservists -- Val isn't so bad, given that it's located so much closer to major population centers.

 

[Nfld Sapper]

The force generation of complete batteries of tube artillery is certainly extremely ambitious, both from an individual and a collective level. What are the guns and prime movers that the reserve artillery are training on? Is it M777 and HLVW? Are the guns dispersed among armories, or are the reservists travelling on weekends? Pet and Shilo certainly have some major travel issues involved for reservists -- Val isn't so bad, given that it's located so much closer to major population centers.

I believe it would be MLVW/MSVS w/ C3 105mm or LG-1

 

[Petard]

Most reseve Artillery units have C3's, the Atlantic areas have LG1's, a few have 81mm mortars as well; the prime mover is still the MLVW (if working) or improvising with MSVS cargo until the MSVS MilCOT gun tractors show up.

I don't think its necessary to get too hung up on the weapon system just yet; P res units are not going to get M777's, and only rarely will get trained on them.
But the concept of shared Ex aims, and training deltas, was discussed recently at LFCA arty conference, and CO 2 RCHA encouraged P Res units to seek opportunities for participation on Reg F Ex, using their C3's or mortars; if for no other reason than to help maintain awareness of each others capabilities and limitations. Seems like a reasonable goal for next year's Op Planning

This weapon discussion has all the potential of taking this thread off on a tangent: my key point was P res units shouldn't be participating in any type of CT event after March so there's a better chance their pers will be available for RST

 

[bcbarman]

From someone that spent way too much time at LFWA-TC as a reservist augment, it all comes down to treatment of staff.  My first few years (2001-2004) were crap. No support, minimal recognition and who was the duty staff on every weekend?? the "Mo bitch"

It got better in the later years, but the feedback from my co-patriots said that the treatment has gone back to the "Mo Bitch" days. 

One thing that I found from my unit is that in the last 3-4 years there has been a real shortage of class B positions at the units and the HQ.  This is where the majority of the instructors have come from.  As the Class B positions went away, there was no reason to help the unit out.  Why would I go to Wainwright and teach, when I can get $$$ to sit on my tush on the dole , and most importantly, LOOK FOR A REAL JOB!!

As I know I was not the only one to do this, it all comes down to motivating the younger kids to teach while they are still in school, and ensuring that there is a cadre of sr NCO's/WO that are the admin staff for the courses, and let the younger ones do the heavy lifting.

Here I am going to go completely away from the current doctrine.  I think that BMQ-PLQ should be taught at the schools, and DP3-DP5 (Sgt and WO courses) should be taught at the unit level.  These are the rank levels that are hard to get away to train, and are the longest courses.  As for staff, those that passed it previously, and the great resource of the RSS officers/WO that are now at the unit.

My opinion, and that's all.

 

[Ralph]

38 CBG ATG will be taking part in both of 1 RCHA's CT events this FY, along with its own gun ex at the beginning of the training year. The ATG deployed as a third battery on 1 Horse's spring ex two months ago, with no major delta concerns. Once the EMOs resulting from the MID are signed off, there are already enough trained pers to man all avail tubes as well. Things could be a lot worse out here...

 

[Gunner]

38 CBG ATG will be taking part in both of 1 RCHA's CT events this FY, along with its own gun ex at the beginning of the training year. The ATG deployed as a third battery on 1 Horse's spring ex two months ago, with no major delta concerns. Once the EMOs resulting from the MID are signed off, there are already enough trained pers to man all avail tubes as well. Things could be a lot worse out here...

We did this quite a bit back in the 80s and it was a very good experience as c/s 4 with 3 RCHA. 

 

[Disenchantedsailor]

The force generation of complete batteries of tube artillery is certainly extremely ambitious, both from an individual and a collective level. What are the guns and prime movers that the reserve artillery are training on? Is it M777 and HLVW? Are the guns dispersed among armories, or are the reservists travelling on weekends? Pet and Shilo certainly have some major travel issues involved for reservists -- Val isn't so bad, given that it's located so much closer to major population centers.

I'll dispell some myths on this one.  The PRes Arty units are not expected to generate a gun bty per Area (yes they are but in a different manner).  Units have specific stream tasks to provide to their affiliated batteries. for example an indep bty provides say a gun det (8-10 dudes) while another will provide a CP, Halo Det, Dismounted OP and the like.

Given that the Reg Force Deploys 1 Battery at a time the entire reserve FE task bill is never that high. 1 Troop at a time tops.  (30 folks) 2 Guns, CP, Recce, FOO Party (DSMNT) and nope form an entire bty by themselves.

 

[Snakedoc]

What is the solution?
Does the military restructure the training so reg and res recruits train together like the USMC does?
Could that be a possible cost saving measure as well?

I find the direction of the discussion interesting as most people seem to be advocating for an increase in the training delta between Reg and Res in the army.  To give a different perspective, NAVRES has traditionally done the opposite for mbrs up until the OFP and looks to be further decreasing the training delta between Reg and Res in the future.  This decrease in training delta is in line with the transition to a 'strategic reserve' allowing for further interoperability on other operational platforms not traditionally manned by reservists.

For example in the MARS naval officer training world, there is no difference in training standards between a Reg officer and Res officer and Res courses are often taught by either Reg or Res instructors.  Res courses will also often have a few Reg students loaded on it and it was not unusual in the past to have Res students attend Reg courses during the year.  This also goes the same for BMOQ training as well.  BMQ/NETP is undergoing some changes in order to make it more navy oriented and reduce repetitive training while still maintaining the same Reg course standards however.

Within NAVRES, Int has also gone a similar route, more and more Navcomms are attending Reg courses, Bosns are becoming more and more interchangeable between platforms, and I've heard some scuttlebutt about Log coming in line with Reg courses too (not confirmed however).

Navy requirements are clearly going to be quite different from the Army however.  Food for thought but interesting perspective nonetheless.

 

[dapaterson]

The challenge with a part-time Reserve is training cost and skill fade.  Even in the Reg F skill fade is a constant issue; move from 24/7 to 1 night a week, 1 weekend a month and the impact is even more severe.

Providing a sound base of skills that can be maintained and then augmented when required is a more sensible allocation of training time and training dollars than throwing everything iagainst the wall and seeing what sticks.