Simunitions

[Jeff Boomhouwer]

Anyone actually like them.I guess the rounds are OK,its the darthvader in fog face shields that suck.I can understand the training value and the troops are less likely to take unrealistic risks, but I can‘t see a bloody thing.

 

[GhostRecce]

I like the miles gear :soldier:

 

[jonsey]

Ok, Simunition is kinda like paintball, right? and Miles is like laser-tag?

How does the Miles system work?

 

[L/MCpl_Argyll_ Kurrgan]

Simunition in paintball fired like a bullet. No compressed air. Its a 9mm paintball round with a 9mm x 19mm casing. An explosion from the firing pin hitting the primer propels the paintround through special blue barrels. Doesn‘t hurt as much though. Miles gear used the concussion and vibration of blank rounds to initiate a laster mounted and zeroed on the barrel of a weapon. Sensors are worn by soldiers which detect weather rounds are close or if rounds are hitting. Both have their advantages and disadvantages. Simunition has poor range and accuracy. Plus you have to wear a facemask that fogs up so all you can see is grey. And its hard to breathe while wearing it. Also you cannot take aimed shots with the C79 Optical Sight because the goggle eyes from the mast and the general shape of the mask protrude so much that you can‘t get any sight picture what so ever. If you or the enemy force is wearing the Gortex coat to protect yourself from being hurt...its impossible to tell if you‘ve been hit. The bad thing about miles gear is that little jolts and jars set it off. So you could bump into your buddy and shoot him in the back without even pulling the trigger. The laser also doesn‘t shoot through brush and foilage. So if you are providing cover fire from a wooded area or high grass, going prone would be a usless endevour. :fifty: :gunner:

 

[mattoigta]

Originally posted by BOOMER004:
[qb] Anyone actually like them.I guess the rounds are OK,its the darthvader in fog face shields that suck.I can understand the training value and the troops are less likely to take unrealistic risks, but I can‘t see a bloody thing. [/qb]

I HATE simunition UNLESS used for OBUA training. The large awkward headgear restricts your movement, hearing, and vision. You can‘t even aim properly thanks to the odd eyepieces on the mask. It fogs up so easily too, I was doing a patrol last month while it was raining - we could BARELY see anything. Troops were tripping and falling all over the place. And last but not least, the range and accuracy is cut down.

I‘ve heard that whenever the Americans use simunition, instead of using those big stupid masks they just wear their helmet‘s and goggles, and sometimes a balaclava underneath that. I think that would be A LOT better. Has anyone else heard of this?

 

[hhour48]

Sim rounds are also notorious for getting stuck in the barrel, causing a stoppage which is very hard to clear -- you have to pull out your cleaning rods and pull through the barrel.

The new MILES gear doesn‘t react to slight vibrations, only firing the actual blanks will set it off.

 

[L/MCpl_Argyll_ Kurrgan]

NEVER, fire simunition on automatic. There is a reason why large capacity mags are curved. They feed better. The mags for the Simunition Kit are straight and do not feed well at all. On auto you might get a 3 round burst before the weapon will jam. Or worse, all the rounds come loose inside the magazine. Not a good thing in the heat of battle. You also have to be careful when loading the mags. If you are to agressive with the, the actual paint round will pop off and the round will be NS. (NON SERVICABLE) :fifty: :gunner:

 

[stukirkpatrick]

awww...i was looking forward to using either form of training in the new year.

somebody please tell me that with all the observed faults, that MILES WES and simmunition are still ‘fun‘, even just a little?

 

[Redeye]

Simunition is fun subject to a few things. First, they should issue 9mm bore brushes for the Simunition uppers because the barrels get filthy fact. I watched a guy hammering his cleaning rod with a rock to get SEVENTEEN rounds out of his barrel.

Since I saw an idiot do it, you CANNOT fire them from an unmodified Browning - even though the round is 9x19 (9mm Parabellum), the plastic sabot on the round is too long to clear the ejection port on the Browning. He had to disassemble the pistol to get the casing out.

The face shield is a serious problem issue. It would be far better to come up with some sort of mouth protector in order to allow the use of some sort of simple goggle which won‘t fog up. I found that inhaling though the mouth and exhaling through the nose helped alleviate fogging but did not perfectly eliminate it, and it just felt weird to do. During Ex Nakina Wolf 2002 I actually got a migraine which I think was triggered by the helmet and having trouble getting enough air.

Part of the problem was that there was a plastic cover over the mouth of the Darth Vader helmet - once removed, it was much easier to breathe.

Simunition, in short, is a fantastic training aid in limited roles like FIBUA/OBUA, where the tactical situation offsets the ****e range of the system. It requires a great deal of improvement in order to be fully useful.

One neat thing I‘ve learned is that there is a 5.56mm Sim round being developed to go with a conversion kit for the C9, to make it effective in the fire fight.

 

[mattoigta]

on an ex this weekend we were issued "Fog Free" (used on hockey helmets) to counter the fog. It worked really well

 

[Redeye]

I tried using Cat Crap (it‘s marketed primarily to skiers and snowboarders) as an antifog agent but found it only worked for a little while. I‘m glad to hear that they‘ve got something of a fix for the problem. Now they just need to sort out the total inabilility to get a proper sight picture with the mask, and they‘ll be all set. It‘s fine for pistols (which is what they were created for, the law enforcement field), but no good with rifles.

 

[Staff]

Another issue with Simunition rounds is that there is no way to simulate the support weapons in the same manner. For the last couple of years, every time we do FIBUA trg, someone always come up with the gripe, "You know, a grenade would come in handy about now...". Being able to absolutely convince a 19 year old fresh out of battle school that "This is not DOOM, keep your head down", when he is sporting a third nipple in the middle of his forehead is a great training aid though. If only because you only have to tell them once. We trialed the things a couple of years ago in ValCartier, Helmets and AFV Goggles, the rest of the crap we wear came later. Welcome to the new army. SAFETY,SAFETY,SAFETY.

 

[Redeye]

There were prototype paint grenades we used at Skeleton Village at Pet last winter and at Nakina Wolf - something like a coiled tube full of paint - removing the "pin" allows it to unfurl when thrown spraying eerie green death everywhere.

 

[Doug VT]

The plastic on the Simunition round is not to long to cleat the Browning‘s action. When the charge propels the paint "ball" out of the weapon, the heat causes the plastic to expand, thereby firmly lodging itself in the barrel of the pistol...

 

[mattoigta]

there was paint greandes at Stalwart Guardian