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Reservists Job Protection Superthread

Tibbson

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Seanf122 said:
Okay, So basically what I've gathered from this link (which was exactly what I was looking for by the way..Thanks!) is that to go on course and be paid for it from my employer is to request vacation for the the time that I'm away on course. If I need additional time off it will be without pay!

Has anyone (or know of anyone) that had issues with their employers NOT approving vacation time to go away to operations or Training? How was it resolved?

That is considering that you get paid vacation.  I know of plenty of people who have had employers not approve vacation time when it is requested but its usually more of a coordination issue then a jab against the employee going on a military course.  My dads autoparts plant shuts down for three weeks at the start of the summer and does not allow vacation for the remainder of the summer months so that they have the staff to operate.  If a reservist working there wanted to take time at the end of the summer instead then the plant would have an issue with that.  Compassionate or medical reasons aside of course. 

At the end of the day, the availability of vacation time that can be coordinated with any reserve course you may be selected for and the likelihood of getting additional time off, paid or unpaid, is really between you and your employer.  As someone pointed out though, some provinces have certain protections in place re job security when deployed but again, it's unique to the province involved at this time. 
 

Seanf122

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kratz said:
While you should always engage your CoC, the CFLC (Canadian Forces Liaison Council) is another resource to assist PRes with course opportunities. Have you searched the site and checked out CFLC.forces.gc.ca ?


Thank you Kratz. I really like the letter templates they have provided on the CFLC site, It's a fantastic resource! It will certainly assist in persuading the owner to accept my decision to serve as a reservist. Fingers crossed he will continue to pay me, In the end he will be the one benefiting from all the skills I will acquire from the CF.
 

krimynal

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Hello everyone , I just had 1 quick question ,

Basically I started working at a civilian job 3 months and a half ago , when I first met my boss for the 1st interview , I told him I was in the army and I was gonna be going to some summer camps or training camps everyonce in a while , I told him that the army are never really upfront about those camps and that you pretty much always know about them last minute. 

At this time , the boss told me that it didn't care that It would only be a good thing since he could give my hours to the other guys , for the time I was gone , and give me back my job once I get back , which was fine with me. 

Only today I told him I had received my email this morning about going to Vimmy Camp in valcartier this sunday for my QS+PP1 which is gonna last 1 month ( July 7Th to august 10Th )

I called him this afternoon about this , he basically told me that if I left , I wouldn't have my job back , that he was upset and mad at me "for the way I left him no choice but to let me go" .... I found it really really stupid since I told him at my interview and I told him that the army was always gonna come first since that's what I wanted to do in life.

So I was wondering if there was something I could tell him about the fact that he can't just fire me for going away to army training .... not looking into going to court with him or anything , but just want to let him know what the procedures are ( is it true that you can't fire someone that is in the military if he leaves for camp and training ? )

thanks a lot !
 

Eye In The Sky

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There is no such legislation in Canada, that I know of.  We aren't like the US Reserve/National Guards who have their "job protection" laws.

I would say, also, that what you said to your employer isn't accurate.  You have very little, if any, experience in the CAF yet you are stating things "are always this way" with regard to "little to know warning" about leaving for training, etc.

I spent years in the PRes and I always knew, fairly well in advance, that I was going away on a course, callout, Class B, weekend exercise, etc.  This "always last minute/never up front" stuff is bullshit IMO.

Your employer has a business to run, etc and bills to pay/family to feed, and you are leaving him in a tight bind with little notice.  I can understand him being upset.

Re-read what you said you told him in the first interview.  I'd bet a box of donuts he really had no idea it would be "4 days notice" you were leaving and for how long.  He misunderstood and/or you downplayed it perhaps. 

:2c:

 

ModlrMike

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I see from your profile that you're in Quebec.

Go here: http://www2.publicationsduquebec.gouv.qc.ca/dynamicSearch/telecharge.php?type=2&file=%2F%2FN_1_1%2FN1_1_A.htm

You want to scroll down to sect 81.17.1

Given the information you have provided, it appears that the employer is not obliged to let you go to train as you have not been with him for 12 months. As well, an employee must give to the employer advance written notice of not less than four weeks of the date on which the absence is to begin, the reason for it and its duration.
 

mariomike

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krimynal said:
So I was wondering if there was something I could tell him about the fact that he can't just fire me for going away to army training .... not looking into going to court with him or anything , but just want to let him know what the procedures are ( is it true that you can't fire someone that is in the military if he leaves for camp and training ? )

This may help.

Reservists Job Protection Superthread 
http://army.ca/forums/threads/2552.0
 

Jarnhamar

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Don't quit a full time job to take a course in the reserves.

Ask your boss if a leave of absence or whatever is possible. If not then thank him for the consideration, suck it up that you won't get a course and write a memo to your chain of command telling them that if they want to send you on a course you need a month + notice.

Will that notice always happen? No not always. ,It often can and does but also lots of reserve units are notorious for doing exactly what happened to you. 
If you want to be on X course then you have two days to pack. Do you think a regular force member working at your unit or a full time reservist at your unit with a 1-3 year contract is really that torn up over you having to pick between full time civilian work or a course in the reserves?

Most of the guys like you from my old unit that were ready to sacrifice their jobs "for the unit" either quit to go regular force, quit for a full time civilian job or have a full time civilian job and show up in the reserves when it's convenient for them (and not the unit).

Don't quit a full time job to take a course in the reserves.
 

The Bread Guy

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mariomike said:
This may help.

Reservists Job Protection Superthread 
http://army.ca/forums/threads/2552.0
And so we merge to create an even richer mix of information for the consolidated thread.

Milnet.ca Staff
 

mariomike

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For reference,

aliw said:
Hello,

I'm sure this has already been answered before, but I was unable to find any real information on this.

I have began the process of joining the reserves and the prospect of being in the Canadian Forces has been a long time dream of mine. However, being away from my full time job (a job that I love) for 8 weeks will pose an issue. Not to mention, an unpaid absence.

I was curious as to what steps can be taken to minimize the chances of being let go.

I'm sure others have faced similar circumstances; have you been let go from work?

Also the recruiter I met told me that there have been instances where Admirals and Generals have sent requests to CEO's of companies to allow team members an unpaid leave for BMQ and trades training.

I just need more direction in what I should do when I reach this juncture.

Thanks

DAA said:
As a perspective member of the Canadian Armed Forces Reserves, it's usually a good idea to possibly discuss this option with your current employer just to ensure that you have their support.

For your reading pleasure and things you may want to discuss with your employer before hand.........

http://www.forces.gc.ca/en/business-reservist-support/employer-educator-info.page
 

Maxadia

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Hi all,

I know I am reviving an old thread, but I am hoping to gain some clarification in regards to reservist leave, as it relates specifically the Alberta Employment Standards Act.

Under the allowed operations and activities, it states:
"annual training, included related travel time, for up to 20 days in a calendar year"

What is, and what is not considered "annual training"?  Are there any restrictions around that phrase?  My belief was that annual training, as covered under the act, was considered to  be any type of training that the military would be paying a reservist for, whether it was a single day, weekend exercise, or career courses.

If you could offer any clarification, that would be greatly appreciated. Thank you.
 

mariomike

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RDJP said:
What is, and what is not considered "annual training"? 

Reserve Summer Training?
https://www.google.com/search?ei=rnlHXNHEFISvjwTjp5aQBQ&q=site%3Aarmy.ca+%22reserve+summer+training%22&oq=site%3Aarmy.ca+%22reserve+summer+training%22&gs_l=psy-ab.12...0.0..90127...0.0..0.0.0.......0......gws-wiz.7L_SsRCKHuo

RST
https://www.google.com/search?ei=KnpHXJb5GpXvjwSRp4-QBQ&q=site%3Aarmy.ca+rst&oq=site%3Aarmy.ca+rst&gs_l=psy-ab.12...0.0..67941...0.0..0.0.0.......0......gws-wiz.fdtL7K2qVP4
 

Maxadia

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Thanks for the reply, but one of us is not understanding the other, and I am not sure who that is.  8)  Do you mean that reservist summer training is the only thing considered "annual training" under the Alberta act?
 

mariomike

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RDJP said:
Do you mean that reservist summer training is the only thing considered "annual training" under the Alberta act?

No. That is why I put the question mark.  8)
 

RedcapCrusader

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RDJP said:
Thanks for the reply, but one of us is not understanding the other, and I am not sure who that is.  8)  Do you mean that reservist summer training is the only thing considered "annual training" under the Alberta act?

Annual training is any and all training conducted throughout the year.
 

Maxadia

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Thanks for the replies, and mariomike - that clears it up.  I wasn't quite sure.

Basic scenario is that I have an HR person trying to tell me that a previous 3 day course I took in the fall (CTIO) was not "mandatory" like "career courses" are, feels like they were lied to, and is "hesitant to approve my requested leave" for a two week course this summer.  ::)
No one said it was mandatory, just their interpretation after talking to the CO who I think stated that the difference between a one-off course and a career progression course.

Far as I was aware, like Lunchmeat stated, any and all training is "annual training", and hopefully that is what the CFLC will confirm as well.

Thanks again.  ;D
 

Dissident

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Your situation smells political, thread with caution.

An employer balking at giving a reservist 3 days for training one fall, then 2 weeks for training the next summer, seems to be flirting dangerously with bad, bad PR in the land of Alberta. There must be more context to your situation.

Without additional information in the overall situation, I would cautiously advise you to go on the offensive. Are you familiar with the CFLC? http://www.forces.gc.ca/en/business-reservist-support/index.page

Get your supervisor on board. Tell them that you appreciate their help in your dual career. Ask them if they would be willing to help you write a submission for employer recognition award for the CFLC.

A previous employer of mine (Ledcor Construction), went above and beyond with helping me maintain my commitment to the reserve, while they had me working out of country and my wife was deployed. My submission won them a provincial award that we received during the dinner at the war museum. Dinner that a VP and I were flown to.

Good luck.
 

mariomike

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RDJP said:
Thanks for the replies, and mariomike - that clears it up.  I wasn't quite sure.

Far as I was aware, like Lunchmeat stated, any and all training is "annual training", and hopefully that is what the CFLC will confirm as well.

Thanks again.  ;D

Hopefully, HR and CFLC will go by LunchMeat's interpretation of "annual". :dunno:

adjective: annual

1. occurring once every year.
"the sponsored walk became an annual event"

synonyms: yearly, once-a-year, every twelve months
"an annual report"

•calculated over or covering a period of a year.
"an annual rate of increase"

synonyms: yearlong, lasting a year, twelve-month
"an annual subscription"

noun

1. a book or magazine that is published once a year under the same title but with different contents.
"a Christmas annual"

https://www.google.com/search?source=hp&ei=vdpHXMD5AoHLjwSEy4DwDQ&q=annual&btnK=Google+Search&oq=annual&gs_l=psy-ab.3..0i67l10.1669.3184..3810...0.0..0.390.1090.3j3j0j1......0....1..gws-wiz.....0..35i39j0i131j0j0i131i67.qHaHde3V1f8


 

Maxadia

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Mariomike, I do believe it is all in the interpretation of the word, and I am waiting to see the CFLC's interpretation.

NinerSix - pm incoming.  ;)
 

mariomike

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RDJP said:
Mariomike, I do believe it is all in the interpretation of the word, and I am waiting to see the CFLC's interpretation.

That's what it sounds like. Good luck.
 

Maxadia

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From the CFLC rep: training is training, regardless of what it is.

Thanks all.
 
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