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President Trump Discussions- merged thread

If it were true the allegation Obama/Biden/HRC and senior FBI,CIA,DOJ officials manufactured the Rus

  • I have always favoured Trump and continue to do so

    Votes: 8 34.8%
  • I favoured the other side in the past, but now favour Trump

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • I favoured Trump in the past, but now favour the other side

    Votes: 1 4.3%
  • I have never favoured Trump and this doesn't change it for me

    Votes: 8 34.8%
  • Undecided

    Votes: 6 26.1%

  • Total voters
    23
  • Poll closed .
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Ostrozac

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Brihard said:
It wouldn't be that clean. While S.15 can be 'notwithstood', Parliament built an explicit protection of sex into the Charter in S.28. That section cannot be notwithstood.

Good catch. Looks like during WW3 Parliament will have to content itself with internment camps and the death penalty. Which are both probably still notwithstanding-capable. Oh, and also gender-neutral conscription.
 

shawn5o

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I didn't know where this could be placed so here it is.

I can't believe that politicians in Oregon can be that daft.


https://pjmedia.com/news-and-politics/jeff-reynolds/2020/08/30/insane-portland-mayor-ted-wheeler-blames-trump-for-deadly-shooting-n865503

Portland Mayor Ted Wheeler Blames Trump for Deadly Shooting
BY JEFF REYNOLDS AUG 30, 2020 8:50 PM EST

Portland Mayor Ted Wheeler gave a press conference on Sunday regarding the fatal shooting of a Trump supporter Saturday night. Wheeler bordered on insanity in his remarks, simultaneously blaming President Donald Trump for the violence and saying that not enough evidence existed to determine if the shooting was politically motivated. The chilling effect of his remarks was to imply, essentially, that Trump supporters had it coming.

In the ultimate expression of Trump Derangement Syndrome, Wheeler ignored the swarms of antifa rioters from out of state, warning out-of-state right-wing agitators not to come to Portland for “retribution.”

“Yesterday’s events began with hundreds of cars filled with supporters of the president, rallying in Clackamas County and then driving through downtown Portland,” Wheeler said. “They were supported and energized by the president himself. President Trump, for four years, we have had to live with you and your racist attacks on black people. We learned early about your sexist attitudes towards women. We’ve had to endure clips of you mocking a disabled man. We’ve had to listen to your anti-democratic attacks on journalists. We’ve read your tweets slamming private citizens to the point of receiving death threats, and we’ve listened to your attacks on immigrants.”

The long laundry list of complaints kept going, ultimately leading to Wheeler’s accusation that the riots plaguing American cities were the fault of President Trump. “It’s you who have created the hate and the division,” he said. “It’s you who have not found the way to say the names of black people killed by police officers, even as people in law enforcement have.” Wheeler then repeated the debunked claim that President Trump had praised white supremacists.

Bizarrely, he then called on every other elected leader in Oregon to stop the violence, as if the riots in Portland have been the fault of anyone else besides the mayor of Portland...

...

Finally, Multnomah County District Attorney Mike Schmidt spoke, portraying this killing as a tragedy that undermines the protests for social justice reform. Schmidt gave a perfunctory statement of condolence for the victim and his family, then a diatribe about racial injustice. “We are stunned and saddened, angry and frustrated that this happened in our community. That the right or the duty to peacefully protest and speak out for an end to systemic racism that has plagued our country for generations could be undermined by this terrible act of violence.”

He actually said that.

Gov. Kate Brown, Multnomah County Chair Deborah Kafoury, and even Joe Biden weighed in:

(basically repeating Wheeler’s “accusations”)

LINK
 

mariomike

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shawn5o said:
I can't believe that politicians in Oregon can be that daft.

https://pjmedia.com/news-and-politics/jeff-reynolds/2020/08/30/insane-portland-mayor-ted-wheeler-blames-trump-for-deadly-shooting-n865503

Read an opinion from a member here in US Politics about the Washington Post yesterday: "quite likely the most unabashedly anti-Trump media outlet in America".

If "media bias" is a legitimate topic of discussion, regarding pjmedia,
https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/pj-media/


 

Brad Sallows

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Wheeler isn't daft in blaming Trump for a host of ills; Trump being responsible for The Everything is mainstream, and the majority is always sane.

The daftness is expressed, rather, in this summation:

"Bizarrely, he then called on every other elected leader in Oregon to stop the violence, as if the riots in Portland have been the fault of anyone else besides the mayor of Portland..."

That's pretty conventional for a politician - blame everyone else.
 

Ralph

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Brad Sallows said:
Wheeler isn't daft in blaming Trump for a host of ills; Trump being responsible for The Everything is mainstream, and the majority is always sane.

The daftness is expressed, rather, in this summation:

"Bizarrely, he then called on every other elected leader in Oregon to stop the violence, as if the riots in Portland have been the fault of anyone else besides the mayor of Portland..."

That's pretty conventional for a politician - blame everyone else.

https://www.rev.com/blog/transcripts/portland-officials-mayor-ted-wheeler-press-conference-transcript-on-protest-shooting

But the mayor didn't blame everyone else. What he ACTUALLY said was:

"I’m also calling out every other elected official in Oregon to join me, not only in defeating racism, but also in helping me to stop the violence as we are and will continue to be held accountable by all of our residents. Today, we need to decide who we are and where are we want to go from here. Don’t let this be the spark that’s sets off an acceleration of hostilities in our beautiful city. Those are not our values. What happened last night does not move us forward. It sets us back."
 

Brad Sallows

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You are correct; "blame" is the wrong word.  The game he's playing is the one in which he makes "his" problem "our" problem.
 

shawn5o

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mariomike said:
Read an opinion from a member here in US Politics about the Washington Post yesterday: "quite likely the most unabashedly anti-Trump media outlet in America".

If "media bias" is a legitimate topic of discussion, regarding pjmedia,
https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/pj-media/

Hi MM

WaPo along with CNN, NYT, Huffpo, etc. are well known for their contempt against Trump

Mediamatters/fact check is left leaning.

From Wikipedia; "The Columbia Journalism Review describes Media Bias/Fact Check as an amateur attempt at categorizing media bias and Van Zandt as an 'armchair media analyst.'"
 

mariomike

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shawn5o said:
WaPo along with CNN, NYT, Huffpo, etc. are well known for their contempt against Trump

"Fake news" and "enemy of the people"!

But, don't dare question links on here from sources I never heard of that support him.

Got it!  ;)

Media Bias [Merged]
https://army.ca/forums/threads/18397.1275
56 pages.
 

shawn5o

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mariomike said:
"Fake news" and "enemy of the people"!

But, don't dare question links from sources I never heard of on here that support him.

Got it!  ;)

Hey MM

I never wrote "Fake news" and "enemy of the people" nor do I believe in it. I do believe mainstream media is biased (both sides). That's it and that's all.
 

mariomike

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Shawn, it's not you. It's the links to sources I never heard of that I wonder about.

:cheers:

Media Bias [Merged]
https://army.ca/forums/threads/18397.1275
56 pages.

And no, QV, looking up political links from sources I never heard of posted on here is not trolling.
 

shawn5o

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mariomike said:
Shawn, it's not you. It's the links to sources I never heard of that I wonder about.

:cheers:

Media Bias [Merged]
https://army.ca/forums/threads/18397.1275
56 pages.

And no, QV, looking up the sources you post on here is not trolling.

Whew

Thanks MM

:cheers:
 

Blackadder1916

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shawn5o said:
From Wikipedia; "The Columbia Journalism Review describes Media Bias/Fact Check as an amateur attempt at categorizing media bias and Van Zandt as an 'armchair media analyst.'"

So, if you are quoting a comment about the Columbia Journalism Review's (CJR) analysis of media bias/ fact checking to support your viewpoint, are we to assume that you're acknowledging the CJR as a legitimate and fair source for news and opinion?  If so, then this piece from the CJR may be of interest to you.

https://www.cjr.org/the_media_today/trump-turns-up-the-protest-heat.php
Trump turns up the protest heat

By Mathew Ingram AUGUST 31, 2020

On Saturday, protests in Portland turned violent after a convoy of Trump supporters drove into the city, their pickup trucks filled with American flags and in some cases people carrying weapons (although supporters said many of them were paintball guns). Late Saturday night, police and independent journalists on the scene reported that a man was shot and killed after clashing with protesters. While his name has not been officially released, Trump supporters on Twitter identified him as a Trump loyalist, and witnesses reported he was wearing a hat with the insignia of Patriot Prayer, a far-right group based in Washington that has disrupted Black Lives Matter protests and fought with anti-fascist groups in the past (the head of the group later confirmed to the New York Times that the man who died was a member of Patriot Prayer.) Hours later, Donald Trump posted a storm of tweets about the protests, in which he retweeted criticism of Portland’s mayor, Ted Wheeler—a Democrat—including comments that suggested Wheeler was guilty of war crimes and had “blood on his hands.”

Trump’s rhetoric on the Black Lives Matter protests, not just in Oregon but in other states as well, has been ramping up as the election draws closer, painting what he clearly hopes will be a frightening picture of them as ongoing orgies of violence orchestrated by the shadowy, malevolent group known as Antifa (despite the fact that no organization by that name exists). And he and his supporters—both inside the White House as well as outside it—have taken every opportunity to lay the blame for abetting that violence on Democratic politicians like Wheeler and Oregon governor Kate Brown, for what Trump claims is a lack of action against the protesters, including a failure to call in federal troops. “The only way you will stop the violence in the high crime Democrat run cities is through strength!” he tweeted on Sunday, in addition to retweeting a claim (untrue, as Vox has pointed out) that high crime rates only occur in cities or states run by Democrats.

While the president has not explicitly called for violence during the protests, he has made it clear whose side he is on: he invited a couple who brandished weapons during a protest to speak at the Republican convention, and following the death of the Patriot Prayer member in Portland, he retweeted a video clip of another convoy of his supporters heading into the city and called them “GREAT PATRIOTS!” Trump and his administration have also done their best to explicitly tie the violence to Joe Biden, whom they accuse of being soft on violence because of his support for Black Lives Matter protests—Trump followers have recently started using the hashtag #BidenRiots on Twitter, and the president has retweeted them enthusiastically and often. The worldview that Trump is clearly hoping to encourage in voters’ minds is that the violence in Portland and elsewhere is a) a result of the liberal sympathies and general weakness of the Democratic party and by extension the weakness of Joe Biden, and b) that only Trump can ensure that law and order—or “LAW & ORDER!” as he tweeted again on Sunday—is maintained, thanks to the use of federal troops like the ones he sent into DC and Portland not long after the death of George Floyd.

This strategy would be fairly obvious to anyone who has been following the news and/or the president’s Twitter feed over the past few months, but as it turns out, we don’t need to read between the lines, because departing White House adviser Kellyanne Conway spelled it out in so many words during an interview last week on Fox & Friends, in which she said “the more chaos and anarchy and vandalism and violence reigns, the better it is for the very clear choice on who’s best on public safety and law and order.” And Trump seems determined to do whatever he can to make this connection clear: on Saturday night, the White House announced that he will visit Kenosha, Wisconsin, where 17-year-old Trump supporter Kyle Rittenhouse shot several people—killing two of them—during protests on Tuesday night. The president also liked a tweet commending Rittenhouse for being a hero. As Democratic Representative Karen Bass of California said during Sunday’s “State of the Union” on CNN, Trump’s proposed visit to Kenosha has “one purpose and one purpose only, and that is to agitate things and to make things worse.” Wisconsin’s governor has asked him not to come.

When writing about Trump’s Kenosha visit, or his remarks on Portland and its mayor, the media need to be explicit about the political calculations and violent arithmetic that lie behind them. As Edwin Rios put it in Mother Jones, the president’s comments “serve to instigate the violence-riddled vision of American cities he thinks is true. He leverages his platform to decry anti-racist protesters, frustrated at the near-monthly injustices they are seeing as ‘agitators’ to reinforce the misleading notion that American cities, specifically Democrat-led ones, are unruly and in shambles. It’s a Nixonian message from a time long past that’s meant to sow discontent, to create a chaotic view of American life months before his reelection and depict an unstable society that he believes he alone can fix.”
 

Brad Sallows

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>everything is Bidens's fault in Trump's America

False.

And, reformulating it as: "everything is Trump's fault in Trump's America"

Also false.

Disregarding the opportunistic rioters and looters, the core of what people are protesting for is policing reform.  The House Democrats have a bill, and the Senate Republicans have a bill.  Customary practice is for the two bodies to work out one bill in committee, pass it, and send it to the president for signature.  Trump has indicated he would sign such a bill, with one reservation being qualified immunity (which is unlikely to be in any bill which makes it as far as his desk).  So there are no obstacles to implementing some federal measures of policing reform, right now.

Except that the Senate Democrats filibustered the Senate bill.

Minnesota has a split legislature (R Senate, DFL House) and DFL administration.  Minneapolis has a DFL administration (mayor and 12 of 13 council members, remaining member is a Green).  The unrest there is whose responsibility to address?

Oregon has a D Senate and House, and a D governor.  Portland has a D mayor, 3 of 4 commissioners are D (couldn't quickly find the new guy's affiliation), and an Ind City Auditor.  The unrest there is whose responsibility to address?
 

shawn5o

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Blackadder1916 said:
So, if you are quoting a comment about the Columbia Journalism Review's (CJR) analysis of media bias/ fact checking to support your viewpoint, are we to assume that you're acknowledging the CJR as a legitimate and fair source for news and opinion?  If so, then this piece from the CJR may be of interest to you.

https://www.cjr.org/the_media_today/trump-turns-up-the-protest-heat.php

Wow BA. Are we in the same ball park?

Yes, CJR is a legit source for news. It is slightly slanted in its reporting. And it seems to me that  your cherry picking as I think you ignored some context.

Hi MM

WaPo along with CNN, NYT, Huffpo, etc. are well known for their contempt against Trump

Mediamatters/fact check is left leaning.

From Wikipedia; "The Columbia Journalism Review describes Media Bias/Fact Check as an amateur attempt at categorizing media bias and Van Zandt as an 'armchair media analyst.'"

It was just a simple and accurate statement of media that lean left. Obviously, I prefer media that leans to the right. BTW, wikipedia can be considered left leaning.

Cheers
 

Donald H

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shawn5o said:
BTW, wikipedia can be considered left leaning.

Cheers

If it is then it's due to who contributes to Wikipedia. It's important t know how Wikipedia works.

https://www.dailydot.com/unclick/how-does-wikipedia-work/

It's likely the only site that can't be accused of media bias, either right or left.

 

Brad Sallows

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Politically-charged topics on Wikipedia are notorious for "editing wars", and I have read nothing to make me believe that the "left" does not have the upper hand.
 

Donald H

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Brad Sallows said:
Politically-charged topics on Wikipedia are notorious for "editing wars", and I have read nothing to make me believe that the "left" does not have the upper hand.
If the left has the upper hand on Wikipedia then the right's not doing their job.
You are familiar with how Wikipedia works?

If you're still convinced that the left has the upper hand on Wikipedia then can you expalin your reasoning? Not that I'm saying you aren't right, just that I don't know 'how' you could be right?

:cheers:
 

Brad Sallows

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Editing history and commentary is part of Wikipedia.  Occasionally some of the main contributors get sick enough of "editing wars" to write articles about it.
 

garb811

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How many times are people going to wade into the *bias debate? There's a specific thread dedicated to media bias, take it there and stop spamming the rest of the board with it.

- Milnet.ca Staff
 

Brad Sallows

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It will likely continue if responses to linked articles are allowed to consist of "media bias blah blah blah" without any actual engagement of the idea/theme/point.

Maybe a site policy that if anyone has issues with media bias for an article, they post to the media bias topic only and leave the main topic alone?  People who wonder about bias can go to the media bias topic to see if anyone had anything to say.
 
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