Pistols

[PhilB]

Just a quick question, how many pistol magazines are being issued overseas. If there is an opsec problem in answering this question please feel free to pm me. Im asking because im considering purchasing a chest rig for the TF 1-06 deployment and was wondering how many pistol magazine pouches would be required. Thank you

 

[MG34]

3 pouches will do,unless it has changed since Roto 0 each pistol came with 4 magazines.

 

[TangoTwoBravo]

There are some members of this board who can give much better advice than me on this topic but I'll throw in my two cents.  Forgive me if I tell you something that you already knew, but make sure whatever pistol rig you get will be easy to incorporate into wearing your Gen III body armour and Tac Vest.  You may find a chest rig a pain, in that on a given day you might take your vest and plates on and off several times while still wanting to have your pistol handy (you are adding an extra step).  For vehicle crews this can be a major issue as they will still wear the Gen III vest but take off the tac vest in the vehicle.  I bought a thigh rig and a retention lanyard and was very happy (and I didn't spend over 100 USD).  With a thigh rig you will always have a weapon handy no matter what you are doing with your body armour and you won't have to put in on and off every time you take on and off your vests.

Still, to each his own and perhaps there is a perfect chest rig that works well with body armour and tac vests!  Just beware of policies regarding non-issue kit (these can vary wildly between units).  The more low-key and non-flashy your non-issue kit is the better chance you have of not getting on the kit police radar screen.

Cheers

 

[MG34]

A thigh rig is good if you are out and about but they are less than idea when in a vehicle,espescially as the issued piece of crap doesn't properly fit the pistol.A chest rig is the far better choice if you are going to be vehicle mounted and staying there.ie Crewman in a Coyote,if you are going to be dismounted most of the time and using a veh merely for transport you are better off buying a good quality thigh rig that fits the pistol you are using.Your main weapon is still the C7A2/C8A1/SFW you will have to become proficent in it's use while mounted,a pistol is a back up only except in certain limited scenarioes.

 

[Britney Spears]

To be perfectly accurate, Phil wasn't asking about a holster, he was asking about pistol mag pouches on his webbing.

The only thing I can contribute here is that most cases when you need your pistol, you'll need it fast, so it helps to have the damn thing in one instinctive place. Now I know we do issue chest holsters but they are the exception rather than the norm, and 99% of us are trained to instinctively go for the hip, even inside a vehicle.

 

[Kal]

As Britney alluded to, if you don't have a holster that would allow the draw to be instinctive and smooth, then get one.  Personally, I would go a step further and buy a red gun or a cheap airsoft pistol to practice my draw and in case of the airsoft practicing mag changes.  Something you may also want to think about, if you haven't already, is if you are going to transition straight to your pistol incase of a stoppage in your rifle... 

    To answer your question though,

Im asking because im considering purchasing a chest rig for the TF 1-06 deployment and was wondering how many pistol magazine pouches would be required. Thank you

    how many mags are you going to bring?  ;D  JK

 

[COBRA-6]

I was only issued 2 (roto 4)    I'm going to try and get 2 more in a week or two when the RQ isn't so busy. I bought a Tactical Tailor thigh holster in CADPAT from Dave's Surplus and am very happy with it so far. Fits the pistol well, and has an easy and instinctive draw. As for non-issue the word went out that aftermarket is OK as long as it's a tactical colour. I saw one of the TFK leadership sporting a Safariland the other day... The only problem with thigh holsters is that they can be awkward to draw while seated in a vehicle, I'm still trying to figure out a way to solve this...  :-\

 

[Slim]

Move the whole holster onto the upper portion of your leg (the part that is on top in the vehicle in a seated position) and you should find that your hand sits quite naturally on top of the pistol.

Hope this helps.

Slim

 

[Acorn]

Slim,

That's great if you spend all, or the vast majority, of your time in the vehicle. If you're out and about, say doing CIMIC stuff and talking often to the locals while outside the veh, your hand rests naturally at the side while standing/walking. Is there a rig that readily moves from top of the thigh to the side, without being too loose in any one posn?

Acorn

 

[Slim]

Acorn

PM inbound

Slim

 

[Fdtrucker]

Issued 2 mags on Op Athena Roto 2. Roto 3 was issued only 2 mags at least while I was still there.

 

[Slim]

Issued 2 mags on Op Athena Roto 2. Roto 3 was issued only 2 mags at least while I was still there.

If I were you and in a live "theatre" I'd beg borrow or.....well I'd get more anyway.

Slim

 

[Fdtrucker]

Getting extra mags would have been easy, getting the rounds  for them from the RQ was another thing.

 

[Slim]

Getting extra mags would have been easy, getting the rounds   for them from the RQ was another thing.

Ahh...There is that.

 

[MTAB]

Here is what worked for me for my 2 trips to The 'Stan.  I am sure some have better techniques but this worked personally for me:

5 pistol mags; 1 in the gun, 3 mag pouch on the upper strap of my chest rig (opposite shooting shoulder; I'm a freak that shoots rifle lefty and pistol righty) the 5th I put in my E&E kit.

Found out that thigh rigs are cool but not very functional for general puropse (personal opinion here) i.e vehicle travel, running 1500 meters to attack an OBJ (that was a hoot!).  I had a 4 mag pouch chest rig, each pouch held 3 mags.  I'd stuff 3 of them with rifle mags and I used the last one to put my pistol in; it fit nice and rode well on the IBA, was up high for vehicle travel, balanced the rig well and was very handy.  One mag in the gun, one mag on the stock and 3 extra in a side pouch.  Be careful of stock pouches, make sure your charging handle will clear it especially on the M4 or equivelent.  just my 2 cents

V/R
MTAB

 

[Slim]

A couple of thoughts on the thigh rig.

I assist in instructing at a school that teaches combat handgun and shotgun shooting to industry pros who have a viable and legal need to learn the skill of arms. Amoung our clients are several groups of CF members who deploy to various places (nothing sneaky or mysterious)

they have tried out the thigh rigs we use and seem to like them quite a bit (don't know the name off hand. I'll have to look it up) The holsters we use fit pretty snugly to the leg, have a good thumb-break and can be drwn very quickly with a bit of practice. Also I have found that most folks wear the thing too far down their legs. The hand should be able to cover the body of the holster when just hanging naturally beside the body. It will still fit under the LBV in that posn and conform more securly to the body.

As for ammo pouches, some of our students prefer to keep them on their legs next to the pistol. That way its still there should you have to remove your LBV for any reason.

Just my thoughts..All comments welcome...Even the trivial and irrelevent ones.

Cheers

Slim

 

[MTAB]

Slim,
mag pouches on the same side as the holster?  Are these the main or back-up? Even if the mags are on the front side of the holster seems a far reach across the body standing, bit difficult prone or re-loading sitting in a vehicle especially with a bulky vest/IBA combo.  Good idea for spares though.  I'll have to practice that, maybe I have been missing something.

V/R
MTAB

 

[Slim]

Slim,
.    Good idea for spares though.   I'll have to practice that, maybe I have been missing something.

V/R
MTAB

Drop into the low isoscelese stance while changing mags. Allows the pistol to stay on taret in a tactical stance during the reload. Same for misfire drills.

For veh use loosen the leg straps of the holster, then slide it onto the top of your leg.

 

[TangoTwoBravo]

I'm learning some good stuff here! 

In the front seat of the Iltis with the doors off I found that the C8 was small enough to wield (not that I fired it from there).  In that case the pistol was a secondary weapon.  In an SUV the confines were a little tight for the C8 so the location of the pistol was more of a concern.  The thigh rig did have issues in the sitting position with all that gear on.  One expedient when in a vehicle was to put it in the empty tac vest mag pouch (after you've loaded your long gun).  Led to a little jiggery-pokery at the clearing bay but all in all a zero-cost solution that I think a lot of folks employed (besides just drawing it during the drive).

Cheers

p.s. As an aside regarding training, we should have less 1914-era rifle range work and more shooting from vehicles etc. 

p.p.s. If you are going to sit in an AFV with a thigh rig then get a retention lanyard.  The pistol can fall out in the vehicle and you won't know it (it happened to someone I know and led to some awkward moments).

 

[MTAB]

2Bravo,
Agree on the SUV; another item to consider(maybe not the best but worked at the time) is a shorty room-broom while riding in an SUV; great contact breaker when driving through tight areas; just the report alone is an eye-opener and might cause the enemy to hesitate a split second.....is that incoming I hear?....haha