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Officers and Swagger Sticks

Snakedoc

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Piper said:
We can't really have a 'if you want to wear it' kind of dress/ceremonial uniform...IMHO.

We already have this with the Navy high-collar whites.  They are authorized for wear but not mandatory.
 

chris_log

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Snakedoc said:
We already have this with the Navy high-collar whites.  They are authorized for wear but not mandatory.

Ah, forgot about those. But, correct me if I am wrong...aren't they in the 'not mandatory, but get them anyways because you're an officer' category? I know some recently commissioned navy folks I know were 'highly advised' to get that order of dress in addition to their mess dress.

Edit: To be honest, if I was a sailor I'd probably invest in those. That order of dress is second only to a piper in full highland regelia in overall 'cool-ness'.
 

Fishbone Jones

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My Regiment's Officers and Snr NCOs wear patrols, and we are in the process of establishing the viability\ need for the Jr ranks. Many of the Reserve Armoured Recce regiments wear them. I wear my DEU once a year at the Men's Xmas dinner. All the rest of the times, when not in CADPAT (or Mess Kit) we are in Patrols. You'll find the reference for them in Ch 5 of the Dress Regs - A-PD-201-000/PT-000

Piper said:
That order of dress is second only to a piper in full highland regelia in overall 'cool-ness'.

Don't be so sure. The chain mail eppaulettes and spurs have turned more than one damsels head ;)
 

Fishbone Jones

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Piper said:
:rofl:

How old ARE you?

;)

Old enough to know and practice the difference between treachery and youthful exuberance  >:D To paraphrase another old bastard around here, first I reached the rank of centurion, then I drove one (for 3 years ;D. Tripwire for NATO, and all that)

The chain mail and spurs are part of the current patrol dress;)
 

chris_log

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recceguy said:
Old enough to know and practice the difference between treachery and youthful exuberance  >:D To paraphrase another old ******* around here, first I reached the rank of centurion, then I drove one (for 3 years ;D. Tripwire for NATO, and all that)

The chain mail and spurs are part of the current patrol dress;)

Ahhh...back when Jesus was a corporal too I assume?  ;D
 

IntlBr

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recceguy said:
My Regiment's Officers and Snr NCOs wear patrols, and we are in the process of establishing the viability\ need for the Jr ranks. Many of the Reserve Armoured Recce regiments wear them. I wear my DEU once a year at the Men's Xmas dinner. All the rest of the times, when not in CADPAT (or Mess Kit) we are in Patrols. You'll find the reference for them in Ch 5 of the Dress Regs - A-PD-201-000/PT-000

Don't be so sure. The chain mail eppaulettes and spurs have turned more than one damsels head ;)

I've always been a little confused that the PRes was able to retain Patrol Dress as an optional item (along with NavRes and RegF Navy) yet the RegF Army was not.  I assume you're PRes then recce?
 

Loachman

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Corps of Guides said:
I've always been a little confused that the PRes was able to retain Patrol Dress as an optional item (along with NavRes and RegF Navy) yet the RegF Army was not.

The Navy did/does not wear Patrol Dress.

Nor did the PRes retain the NavRes and RegF Navy as an optional item.
 

Fishbone Jones

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Corps of Guides said:
I've always been a little confused that the PRes was able to retain Patrol Dress as an optional item (along with NavRes and RegF Navy) yet the RegF Army was not.  I assume you're PRes then recce?

Am now :nod:
 

IntlBr

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Loachman said:
The Navy did/does not wear Patrol Dress.

Nor did the PRes retain the NavRes and RegF Navy as an optional item.

I know... High Collar Whites are the "summer" (tropical) version of Patrol Dress - reference the various PRes bands which parade in them in summer months, as stipulated in the Dress Instructions.
 

Michael OLeary

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Loachman said:
Urinate elsewhere.

Even if mine technically isn't.

That's OK Loachman, you would just change from being a dashing young pilot with a great mustache, to being a dashing young pilot with a great disdain for mustache regulations and orders.
 

my72jeep

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The Anti-Royal said:
I still have mine, as well.  There was at least one occasion, however, where it was carried outside 2 RCR lines (perhaps with an attendant bending of the rules).

In the spring of 1985, I reported to the RCR Battle School as an augmentee course officer and had brought my ash plant.  The RSM gently asked me, "What the f*&k, sir, is that?".  I guess I made it to the Adjt's office just before Mr. Riley got to the CO, and was authorized to carry it.
That wasn't Joe Riley formally of the Guards was it? If it was I can see why you made a bee line for the Adj's office.
 

Old Sweat

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Michael O'Leary said:
That's OK Loachman, you would just change from being a dashing young pilot with a great mustache, to being a dashing young pilot with a great disdain for mustache regulations and orders.

I used to get some flak from the RSM via the adjutant when I was the BC D Bty over my moustache. The dress regulations said something about moustaches not growing beyond the corner of the mouth. Unfortunately the drawing that had gone to the clothing and dress committee was of the Fu Manchu droopy version, not the big handlebar. The adjutant didn't have the balls to take it to the CO, even when I called him, well, some names majors could use to the adjutant.

Loachman, I knew there was something I liked about you besides your tac hel background.

As four patrols, I am of two minds. The order of dress required a lot of upkeep, was not too practical and cost an arm and a leg. It may have, however, saved my butt one night when I was orderly officer in 1 RCHA and I had to intervene in a dangerous situation involving alcohol, adultery and a loaded firearm. Maybe, just maybe, being instantly recognizable as an officer bought me a few seconds to start a discussion with a poor, screwed up troop whose life suddenly had gone way off the rails.
 

Servicepub

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Back to sticks.
At one point, Routine Orders called for soldiers to have a stick in their possession when 'walking out' i.e., leaving camp. Countless photos, up to the Second World War show soldiers of all ranks holding sticks - often supplied by the photographer as a standard prop. In the 18th and 19th centuries the stick was often a soldier's 'weapon' to beat away pesky dogs and peskier civilians who blocked his route.  Until the 1960's (and later in some regiments) a 'stick' was the Colonel's prize to the best soldier - who then carried this for a day or week.
The officers' stick came from the riding crop and was more a badge of class than it was of rank. Again, with the 1968 disappearance of the British-patterned uniform, salute, rank badges et al, the swagger stick also disappeared. The exception is the CMP where an officer may still obtain, upon signature, a riding crop from the Stores in Regina - even though he has no opportunity to carry it.
 

Michael OLeary

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From the Regimental Standing Orders of The RCR, 1960
http://regimentalrogue.com/rcrbadges/rcr-dress_regs_1960.html

Chapter II - Dress Regulations

265.    Officer's swagger sticks will be a dark malacca cane with a silver ferrule and knob. The Regimental Crest will be mounted centrally on the top of the ball knob. When the stick is placed or carried under the left arm the ferrule will be to the front.

266.    The regimental swagger sticks will be 26 inches in overall length, a dark malacca cane with a white metal ferrule and knob. The regimental cap badge 7/8 inch in size will be embossed centrally on the knob. The knob will be 1 3/4 inches in length, the ferrule 3/4 inch. The stick will be carried by Junior Non-Commissioned Officers.

267.    All Warrant Officers will carry regulation ordnance pattern pace sticks unless otherwise ordered.

268.    All Senior Non-Commissioned Officers will carry a drill cane which will be sand coloured malacca, approximately 1 inch in diameter and 36 inches long with a white metal ferrule and knob. Reproduction of the cap badge on the knob will be 7/8 inch in diammeter. The ferrule will be 1 inch in length and the knob 2 1/2 inches. The cane will be 1 inch in diameter at the knob and taper to 3/4 inch at the ferrule.

(The 1967 edition has the same information.)
 

Loachman

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I still have one of the Junior NCO canes.
 
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