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New Foreign and Defence Policy Statements - 19 Apr 05

Enfield said:
Here's a question: what happens, as seems likely, the Liberal gov't falls over the Gomery Inquiry and the Conservatives form a minority or majority gov't after an election? Does all of this disappear?

     In my opinion, if the conservatives win a minority, things will be kept pretty much the same with some tweaking into larger figures, but will still be 'tamed' by the libs and NDP.   However, a majority win, I would think that they would radical change the forces for the better and their financial numbers would be much larger for the forces.   I remember them saying, they wanted to increase the forces strength to 80,000, it didn't say anything about the reserves, but them included, it would lead me to believe the total would be well over 100,000 personnel.   With that said, I am by no means a political analyst, but I believe the figures can still be found on the conservative website, Google it.

sorry I meant to say regular force strength was to be increased to 80,000
 
Gord O'Connor, the Conservative defence critic, essentially said what Karl predicted just a few minutes ago on Newsworld. The only difference was a regular strength of 75,000. He also said the decision making and procurement system would have to be streamlined. (I am a hopeless cynic, but I have always believed that the DND captial acquissition system was designed to keep lots of people busy when the department did not have the money to buy anything.)
 
civvy3840 said:
Darn beat me to it.

How big is the 2005 budget? and what are the governments plans to make the Forces stronger? I've heard they are trying to get 5,000   new army guys, some new helicopters or planes ( can't remember), and a few more ships for the navy. Is all of this correct?

Umm you do know we have discussed the new 2005 budget here already haven't you?
 
I actually started to snicker when I read the part about satellite guided bombs after having digested the earleir "not being anybody's handmaiden" diatribe. If this is the best that a PHD from Oxford can come up with, we really are a lost cause as a country and Oxford better take a good look at their entrance and graduation requirements. Tell me the CDS played little to no role in this document.
 
MikeL said:
http://sympaticomsn.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/1113921587079_3?hub=topstories


The report details for the military:

5,000 new full-time soldiers;
the formation of a special operations task force; and
a plan to purchase new ships, new aircraft and new vehicles.
Hillier says all of the above will be done by 2010.


The report also outlines the formation of a special operations group, which will marry the elite Joint Task Force 2 commando unit with air and sea assets.

Air and Sea assets eh? could we be talking about an Amphibious Assault Squad?
And with the new ships, air craft and vehicles-has there been any word on who gets majority?Land, Sea or Air?
This sounds somewhat good, but it has that foul stench of election talk. :-\
 
Time to address a few things:

The prime minister also outlines in the report the need for Canada to become "an independent voice of pride and influence in the world," as new economic powers like India and China are on the rise and as the threat of terror sweeps the globe.

This is how Martin plans to increase Canadian independence, while I play with the order of this article:

North America will see increased border security measures and also increased integration of its transportation, communications and energy links.


Here is Martin's exciting vision of Canada--purely economic:

"The report acknowledged the U.S. as Canada's most crucial trading partner, but offered no solutions for resolving high-priced disputes on trade issues such as softwood lumber and the re-opening of the American border to our cattle."


Say it with me Mr. Martin:  P-r-o-t-e-c-t-i-o-n-i-s-m.

Instead, the document outlined ways Canada can improve its business relations with booming China and India. It also suggested deepening trade links through a free trade agreement with South Korea.

This will be in addition to our coming free-trade agreement with India. Just think, free-trade with America cost us over 2 million manufacturing jobs, think about how many jobs we can cut if we trade with a third-world country. Oh boy! :D Just think, if have no jobs, then we won't have to work!!!






 
Hmmm, well if no one had work, just think of all of the possible recruits the CF would have ;)....just a side thought anyways. I do not support free trade, never has really worked, never will really work. All this sounds wayy too good to be true coming from the liberals whom I have no more faith in.
They're even trying to undermine OUR DEMOCRACY by telling the opposition when they can have opposition days!!

Dan
 
Just my rant:

I think this foreign policy is just what our organization (the military) needs. It seems that since the Cold War we never had a defined purpose for this coutry, and if there was a purpose it was almost always in support of the US's policies. (Yes, I know our main purpose is the defense of Canada, but we don't fight wars in Canada now do we? Its all about foreign policy. -- that's the key place where we can play a major role.)

If Martin means what he says about "not being the handmaiden of other coutries" and "having a major influence on the world," the 13 billion should be invested into 'deployment capabilities.' In global politics, First impressions mean alot. Remember the incident off the eastcoast when that shipping vessel refused to turn over CF equipment and personel and the special forces had to go in and basically take over the ship? Or how the media mocks us for using Russian planes to transport our equipment? Or more recently, the 2 weeks it took to Deploy DART to Sri Lanca (yes I know some of that was a political debacle -- but still--- they had to wait for the Russian planes). When Dart finally got there they had to push and shove with NGOs to find a spot to deploy.
Being where you're needed and moving there with a sense of urgency can say alot about your commitment and capabilities when it comes to foreign relations. You don't even need state of the art equipment, just being there ahead of everyone else goes a long way.
I mean, if you're waiting outside in the pi$$ing rain for your friend to pick you up from the gym. Do you care if he shows up 30 minutes late in a BMW? Or, would you rather him to arrive on time with his beat-up pinto?

I say first things first. Replace the Hercs with larger aircraft capable of transporting a fully assembled LAV III. Replace the old preserver class ship and get ships that can transport equipment (maybe even a few landing crafts). Heavy lift transport (Chinook) Helicopters have proven their worth in other armies and I think they could go very far in the Canadian. And lastly Bring back the Airborne.

Keep the CF light, mobile and agile, and we can make quite the impression on the world as a fast response force that has its own independent foreign policy which keeps it free of the UN and NATO red tape (i.e. waithing for other nations to agree to commit troops). I mean hey.  not to sound zealous but our foreign policy already mirrors that of the UN and it is already safeguarded from being interpreted as "imperialism" because of the outrage such accusations would cause back here at home.

Bush has already proved the inefficiencies of the UN and on many occassions we have been willing to go to places where we are needed and take the actions necessary to avoid catastrophes (think Rwanda, Somalia, Yugoslavia, Darfur) but have always been held back by the red tape of the UN.  

What do you think?
 
career_radio-checker said:
I say first things first. Replace the Hercs with larger aircraft capable of transporting a fully assembled LAV III.

I agree with most of what you said, but this idea of LAV-capable airlift is something that keeps coming up in discussions like this, in the media, here, and elsewhere - and I always shake my head. Canada will NEVER afford the number of long-range aircraft capable of carrying LAV-IIIs in any quantity large enough to make a difference. Or in other words, a C-17 is something like $350 million Canadian each - and (correct me if I'm wrong) they can only carry 2 LAVs apiece. The CF may very well buy 4 or 5 of these aircraft - I hope so - but to pin our hopes on them to carry LAVs around is unrealistic, unless the CF intends to deploy future tours in platoon or at most company strength.

If we want to both stay relevant AND retain a mostly mechanized land force, then the most important thing we need is fast sealift. Three or four large RO-RO vessels will carry a brigade; you would need thousands of C-17 sorties by hundreds of aircraft over a period of weeks to do the same thing. Airlift is great for getting light forces around, for putting small intervention forces in place quickly, and most importantly, for supplying forces already in place, but for larger-scale deployments of mechanized forces sealift is far more economical.
 
civvy3840 said:
and what are the governments plans to make the Forces stronger?
Funny you should ask this.  Follow any of the above links to get that answer, or try my link (which is almost the same):
http://www.forces.gc.ca/site/reports/dps/main/toc_e.asp

 
S_Baker said:
Aren't we all about free trade?  So then why does the auto pact have provisions that manufacturing has to occur in Canada if America wants to sell cars in Canada?

Well, the way I see it the gravy train is ending an it will be none too soon for me. 

The auto pact was dissolved a few years ago because it operated as an illegal constraint against off shore manufactureres under the rules of the WTO.

The driving force behind manufacturing in Ontario is the availability of a large pool of skilled labour which comes at a bargain basement price due to the exchange rate. Where regulatory mechanisms operate to interfere with such skittish markets like the auto sector, the industries tend to concentrate where there are less fetters and a more disciplined/stable labour market. As a result, the industry is shrinking in Quebec and marginally growing in Ontario. There are also growing problems with the integrity of the business profession in Quebec vis the ROC, which scares investors out of the province without artificial incentives such as subsidies to preserve their ionvolvment in that province. 

The high cost of skilled labour in the US is also working to Canada's advantage. 
 
Guardian said:
I agree with most of what you said, but this idea of LAV-capable airlift is something that keeps coming up in discussions like this, in the media, here, and elsewhere - and I always shake my head. Canada will NEVER afford the number of long-range aircraft capable of carrying LAV-IIIs in any quantity large enough to make a difference. Or in other words, a C-17 is something like $350 million Canadian each - and (correct me if I'm wrong) they can only carry 2 LAVs apiece. The CF may very well buy 4 or 5 of these aircraft - I hope so - but to pin our hopes on them to carry LAVs around is unrealistic, unless the CF intends to deploy future tours in platoon or at most company strength.

If we want to both stay relevant AND retain a mostly mechanized land force, then the most important thing we need is fast sealift. Three or four large RO-RO vessels will carry a brigade; you would need thousands of C-17 sorties by hundreds of aircraft over a period of weeks to do the same thing. Airlift is great for getting light forces around, for putting small intervention forces in place quickly, and most importantly, for supplying forces already in place, but for larger-scale deployments of mechanized forces sealift is far more economical.

Hear, hear! the argument for "jointness". The C-17 costs a cool $250 million USD per unit, and it takes 25 chalks to lift a LAV battlegroup (this is "dry" and without the logistics supplies and support to actually do the job). Having C-17s for the CF to make long distance deployments and carry outsized items is a good idea, but it also has to be scaled to the financial resources we have. A squadron of 6 to replace the "Airbus" fleet is probably maxing out the resources we could apply to airlift.

Fast ships are the way to go, but this also implies a boost in the size of the Navy, since we would also need warships to escort the RO-ROs and provide some support for the troops ashore. The Air Force also needs to expand in order to support both the fleet at sea and the expeditionary force on the ground.

All this is contingent on the Policy review and ultimate "White Paper" actually defining the Grand Strategy of Canada so we can allocate resources to support the overarching vision. (This could also go south really fast, look at what happened to the last White Paper).  I have not finished reading it, but it is very vague in the "commander's intent", which is also a recipie for disaster. What exactly are we supposed to be planning for? Policy papers are only as good as the government that impliments them. Given the past record of the Liberals, the paper is just that; a paper. Only time will tell (Say mid June  ;D)
 
Canada pledges to bolster military
Web posted at: 4/20/2005 9:26:39
Source ::: Agencies
OTTAWA: The Canadian government pledged yesterday to streamline its entire foreign policy, with reforms to the military, increased cooperation in North America and a streamlining of its foreign aid programme.

But the programme-presented by the ministers of foreign affairs, defence, international trade and international cooperation -- was short on details of how much new money would be needed to implement it.

Defence Minister Bill Graham admitted his department would need more new money, above the 13bn dollars ($10bn) in extra funding over the next five years promised in last February's budget.

The defence portion of the government's "International Policy Statement" promises an overhaul of Canada's military equipment, especially with new helicopters and a new fleet of destroyers.

All Graham would say on the financial aspects was that the new policy statement "certainly builds on the budget."

He suggested that much of the money would probably be found by an internal reorganization of the Department of National Defence.

International Cooperation Minister Aileen Carroll said Canada would be concentrating its bilateral aid on 25 countries: 14 in Africa, plus four in the Americas (Bolivia, Guyana, Honduras and Nicaragua), six in Asia (Bangladesh, Cambodia, Indonesia, Pakistan, Sri Lanka and Vietnam) and one in Europe (Ukraine).

The 14 African countries are: Benin, Burkina Faso, Cameroon, Ethiopia, Ghana, Kenya, Malawi, Mali, Mozambique, Niger, Rwanda, Senegal, Tanzania and Zambia.

Carroll told reporters that additional Canadian aid to help other developing countries would be funnelled through international agencies.

But the opposition in Parliament rejected the package as being nothing new.

Stockwell Day, the foreign affairs critic for the main opposition Conservative Party, accused the government of rushing through a meaningless document while it is suffering from a massive lack of confidence as an inquiry into alleged kick-backs for the governing Liberal Party continues to damage the government's reputation.

The Conservatives currently lead the Liberals in opinion polls, due to public wrath over reports of kickbacks to the Liberal Party from advertising companies.

Opposition parties are widely expected to try to bring down the government of Prime Minister Paul Martin next month and force a late June election.

The government moved on Monday to limit the Conservatives' ability to introduce a non-confidence motion into Parliament this week, prompting an angry Harper to say the Liberals were "signing their own death warrant."

"We have three-quarters of Canadians in public opinion polls say(ing) they don't want this government in office," he told reporters.

"Now, if they don't even want to work with the one party that has actually cut them a break from time to time, so be it. They do so at their peril."


A series of recent opinion polls show that if an election were held now, the most likely result would be a minority Conservative government. The Liberals have been in power since November 1993.

Opposition parties can usually introduce non-confidence motions on so-called opposition days, which are decided upon by the government. The Conservatives were due to have an opposition day on Wednesday but the Liberals canceled it when they learned their opponents wanted to control the timing of such days.

"It was a clear attempt to hijack (Parliament)," Liberal minister Tony Valeri told reporters. "As a government we simply could not allow that to happen."

If the remaining opposition days are canceled or rescheduled, the only way the other political parties could bring down the government would be to defeat its budget implementation bill when it is debated in Parliament next month.

"I think there's a greater urgency to indicate to the government that we're not prepared to work with them any longer when they behave in a manner that they did today," said Valeri's counterpart in the Conservative Party, Jay Hill.

"Now the gloves are off."

http://www.thepeninsulaqatar.com/Di...th=April2005&file=World_News2005042092639.xml

This should get interesting...
 
Here is a few comments and questions, just to stir the pot a little...

I will admit I am pretty ignorant when it comes to how the Navy fits into the grand scheme of things.  Outside of boarding parties in support of land ops, I am completely unfamiliar with what it is they do. However my ignorance on any given topic hasn't stopped me from sharing my opinion before, and I see no reason why it should stop me now  :D

If Canada were to persue this new fangled sea lift capability, would the Navy have to change the way it does business as well? For example, if today's navy is tasked with general patrolling in support of land ops, would they have to re-role into a more direct support role, such as overwatch while landing troops in some "failing state", direct supply for the troops who land, etc etc? How will that affect the usefulness of the equipment of what they already have? What I am trying to say is when an army changes its role/focus, it can involve a huge amount of new equipment and training...is it safe to assume the navy would need someting similar?

Furthermore, does Canada need to develop a unit that specialises in dealing with these Roto 0 situations? A traditional marine type unit?
 
I have only had one quick read through the IPS document.  It is a bit of a jumble - too much detail, programme level detail, in some areas; too broad a brush, even for a policy statement which is more like an old fashioned Green Paper than a White Paper.*  The document is too full of platitudes and generalizations - something for every possible constituency and too full of repeats from the budget - 5,000 more people, etc, and too empty of new ideas.

I see that a couple of Jennifer Welsh's ideas made it:

"¢ No more middle powers; and

"¢ A niche military.

I don't, normally, think much of Jeffrey Simpson's foreign policy 'ideas' but I think he has got some good points - highlighted by me - below, from today's Globe and Mail at: http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/ArticleNews/TPStory/LAC/20050420/COSIMP20/TPColumnists/

A reasonable guide to Canadian foreign policy

By JEFFREY SIMPSON
Wednesday, April 20, 2005 Page A17

With so many leaks, speeches, decisions and errors already recorded in the Martin government's foreign policy, nothing could have surprised Canadians in yesterday's foreign policy statement.

Unfortunately, the statement did not correct mistakes -- governments being habitually unwilling to admit error. So the splitting of Foreign Affairs and International Trade remains. So does the creation of a Canada Corps inside the foreign aid bureaucracy. The damage done by the ham-fisted method of declining participation in anti-ballistic missile defence can't be undone.

That said, this statement represents a reasonable guide to Canadian foreign policy. It took far too long to prepare, so long that it has become almost irrelevant. It tries to be all things to all people, as these documents usually do. It's overwritten and can't quite bring itself to speak home truths to Canadians.

But it gets one thing absolutely right, and proposes to do something about it -- that Canada's capacity to do foreign policy has declined owing to years of budgetary neglect for defence, foreign aid and diplomacy.

To this government's credit, it acknowledged the problem. "We need to be realistic and frank with ourselves," says Prime Minister Paul Martin in the introduction. "Recent years witnessed a relative decline in the attention Canada paid to its international instruments . . . Our diplomatic network, our foreign aid and trade policy capacity, our defence capabilities, and our commitment to development suffered as a result."

He got that right. Except the Prime Minister probably underestimated the degree of Canada's decline in the world. As a recent report for the Canadian Institute for International Affairs documented, foreigners think benignly, but not often, about Canada. In almost every field, world trends are working against Canada's influence -- the rise of a single superpower, the problems of multilateral institutions, the shrinking Canadian share of foreign investment, the inadequacies of Canadian defence capabilities. Canada has to lean hard against those trends.

Canada had become a moral superpower in its own mind, a state of self-satisfied illusion, even delusion, that warped all aspects of foreign policy and quietly eroded the country's standing abroad. Individual Canadians were doing great things overseas; the government was not doing great things as often as Canadians liked to believe. To the government's credit, Canada will be spending more in every foreign policy area in the next five years. Will that increased spending be enough to satisfy interest groups such as the voluble defence and foreign aid lobbies? Of course not. But the proposed spending increases are sizable, and the policy directions sensible.

To wit: It's been obvious for years -- and pointed out by umpteen commentators -- that Canada's foreign aid was far too widely scattered. Not only was there not enough aid, but Canada sprinkled it hither and yon, often for domestic political reasons or to plant a little Canadian flag in some country. The foreign policy statement says two-thirds of Canada's bilateral aid (up from about 40 per cent) will be redirected by 2010 towards only 25 countries that are among the poorest of the poor but have reasonably efficient governments. Good. It's about time.

To wit: Canada had a very low ratio of diplomats abroad to those at head office in Ottawa. (The same criticism could be made of the Canadian International Development Agency, too.) Why? Because it costs more to post someone overseas; so, for budgetary reasons, too many officers sat in Fort Pearson in Ottawa. Now, more will be sent abroad.

To wit: Canada had closed consulates in the United States, restricting the country's abilities to do public diplomacy, a must down there. Now consulates are being reopened and a new unit created in the Canadian embassy in Washington to do public diplomacy.

The Polaris Institute and the NDP immediately claimed yesterday's statement lined Canada up with U.S. defence policy. Knee-jerk rubbish. The statement usefully orients Canadian foreign policy and defence towards working through the United Nations to help failed or failing states

Foreign Affairs will get money to prepare to assist such states, especially with civil society; Defence will get personnel and equipment to help stabilize dangerous situations. It's part of what the document, in a flight of rhetorical fancy, calls the "new multilateralism."

Big-bang integrationists, the folks who want a headlong leap into a common external tariff and a common security perimeter around North America will be disappointed. That's good, too.

I will take some time over the next few days to read the IPS in detail and make my own comments, here.

----------
* A Green Paper is meant to be a consultation document issued by the government containing policy proposals for debate and discussion before a final decision is taken on the best policy option. A Green Paper will often contain several alternative policy options. Following this consultation the government will normally publish firmer recommendations in a White Paper.  A White Paper is a document issued by a government department which contains detailed proposals for legislation. It is the final stage before the government introduces its proposals to Parliament in the form of a Bill or in the Budget. When a White Paper is issued, it is often accompanied by a statement in the House from the secretary of state of the department sponsoring the proposals. A White Paper is sometimes produced following the consultation process which is undertaken when the government issues a Green Paper.

 
MasterPrivate said:
Furthermore, does Canada need to develop a unit that specialises in dealing with these Roto 0 situations? A traditional marine type unit?

    yeah, we had a unit like that and for that purpose....  the Airborne Regiment.
 
Kal said:
      yeah, we had a unit like that and for that purpose....   the Airborne Regiment.

Ah!   That would be a big yes and a NO.   They were a Quick Reaction Force for Canadian Sovereignty missions, not necessarily for foreign operations.   They were capable to be deployed, but were seldom sent outside of Canada.   They were in Cyprus for the War, in 1974, between the Greeks and Turks, but didn't deploy again outside of Canada until Somalia.  
 
Ex-Dragoon said:
Umm you do know we have discussed the new 2005 budget here already haven't you?

Sorry when I posted that I was kind of falling asleep so just disregard that post.
 
Edward Campbell- I would disagree with the assertion in the article you posted regarding a trend towards a unipolar world.

The trend as I see it is actually going in the other way. Regional power blocs are asserting themselves more so than before, and this only increase will continue. While the US certainly has a preponderence of military strength, economic and political strength is far more diffused. In regional affairs, China, Japan, and Europe can directly challenge the US. This trend will grow; by 2040, so the economists with crystal balls tell us, the ranking of powers will be much different. China, US, then India, Europe then a bunch of middle-power types. Now I don't entirely buy these predictions, but I do see growing counter-balances to US hegemony. I also see severe limits to what any one state can accomplish in the world, given the transnational nature of many problems.

I see a multi-polar world developing and a world where multilateralism is a necessity. Canada is a large player in this world, and I see our role growing beyond what it has been in the past. Given our economic strength, moral and political authority, and relatively new independence from the UK and growing independence from the US, I think we're on our way to becoming a real country.  :)

This policy paper was full of good ideas and broad, sweeping statements, which I guess is its purpose, but until there are solid numbers and acquisition plans laid out, its meaningless.

Oh - and I hate the idea of a 'niche' military... Its a policy for irrelevance. Would any advocate a niche police service?
 
A lot of people on this board who believe the Conservatives are the solution to everything, I notice. Sure, it's reasonable to be skeptical of a Liberal defence policy. But do you honestly believe a Conservative defence policy would be more credible? If so, where are our 12 nuclear subs? Our 400 tanks? Anyone remember those promises? Mulroney's grand plan folded like a cheap suitcase, with "deficit-fighting" as a flimsy excuse.

At least the Liberal gov't eventually delivered on all the equipment proposed in the 1994 White Paper, as inadequate as that was.

Conservative commitment to defence is as shaky as Liberal...Harper & friends talk a good game, that's all. Your blind faith in the Cons will be shaken when they come to power, trust me.
 
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