MOC training for NES OP - or other Naval OP trades for that matter

[Collin.t]

I just went through pretty much all the pages about the navy on this site and well didn't get much out of it.

So here's my question but before a little background for a better answer.

I already did 3 years of service with the reg force, almost completed my QL3 training as a Comm Rsch (291) (sort of quitted the trade 2-3 weeks before grad) and served the remainder of my 3 years as a RMS clerk on CFB Esquimalt, on the base stricly). Then I served a little while in the reserve and now I am transfering back in the reg force for good, but not as a RMS clerk (hate hate hate the trade).

So right now I am very much considering the NES op trade. I am aware of what is the trade general tasks, also of the watches, and duties on a ship.

I would like to know, from the trade description they talk quickly about digital photography for intelligence purposes, now I have learned the hard way that those trade description do not really tell the reality of the trade. So from experience can anyone talk to me about that aspect of the trade. Also about training, foreign training and exchange possibilities, general experience within the trade or with member of the trade and honest future perspective for a member of the trade.

Also are there any uses for a NES op with IT skills ?

Thanks in advance

Collin

 

[S McPhee]

Hello,

Just wondering if anyone could give some insight on what MOC training will be like for a NES OP?  (ie. what is the schedule like, difficulty of the course, atmosphere, etc)



Any info is always appreciated

 

[Melbatoast]

I'm not a NESOP, but the QL3 for the Ops Room trades follow the same basic style.

It's mostly classroom work, pretty similar to first and second year college or university.  Lectures and notetaking.  The atmosphere is relaxed, because you and your instructor will be spending six months or so together.  I have sailed with several of the instructors at the NESOP school and they're easygoing guys.

There will be phases of the course that take place on a ship (while alongside) and at the Naval Combat Operator Trainer (NCOT), which is a shore based Ops Room simulator.  It's a good 80-85% in the classroom, though.

The classes are small, generally ten students.

Hours while in school are 0800 to 1600, usually an hour for lunch, and a couple of half days per week for PT in the afternoon.  The shipboard phase takes place in the evening so you don't disturb the ship's routine (1600-2359)

You will probably spend some time on PAT after you arrive in Esquimalt from basic, rather than going straight to QL3.  If the guys at the school handling you are proactive, you can get some useful things done during that time - I did my OSQAB (now NETP) and got my military driver's licence while I was on PAT at the Sonar school thanks to the instructors who wanted to keep even PATs busy.  You may get temporarily attached to a ship, too, but that will almost always be for grunt work like painting, and you probably will not go to sea, especially if you aren't NETP trained.  I did some painting in HMCS Calgary, and my ship currently has several NESOP PATs working for the Deck Department as we speak.

It is virtually impossible to fail an Operator course.  Students have to be run through to fill seats in the Fleet, at almost any cost.  You can still try hard and learn a lot, but you can also pass if you put little real effort in and spend your free time partying or whatever.  If you do the latter you'll get familiar with training review boards with a poor course report and a subsequent poor start to your career and other hassles, but you'll pass.  Remember, if you acheived the appropriate level on your CFAT and were offered the job to begin with, there's no reason you should fail the course.

note - NESOPs have it good because the trade school is in Dockyard, not at Naden, so you can eat at the Fleet Club instead of the Nelles Block Galley.  Less marching, too, only from the base clothing supply building to Black Rock, which can't be more than 300 meters.

 

[S McPhee]

During QL3 or MOC training in Esquimault, do you stay in a private room or do you get a roomate(s)?

 

[Melbatoast]

You'll have a roomate or three - at max, there are four people to a room.  When I was there you could have a TV (including digital cable and stuff like the Playboy Channel), computer, stereo, and whatever other conveniences you could jam in.  A guy on my QL3 course had an oriental rug and a potted palm tree.  In my 4-man room there were 3 televisions, my computer, an X-Box and PS2, and a couple of stereos.  You can be there in the same room for a year or more so it pays to be comfortable.

They kind of try to get guys of the same trade together (in my day at least), but not always.  You could just as easily have a class B reservist who works shift work and/or likes to party nightly.  There's a lot of potential for roomate drama - make sure you bring any problems with roomates up through your chain of command rather than just suffering through it.

 

[winnipegoo7]

Could someone please explain the career progression of an NES Op?  I have recently put in a component transfer from the Reserve Infantry to this trade, but I do not have din access and therefore unable to view the occupation specification guide.  (if one even exists?)

I am aware that one would receive Naval Environmental Training and then the QL-3 but what comes next, posted to a Destroyer/Frigate?  When does one take their QL-5?
When would spec pay begin? (is there still spec pay?)
When does one go on PLQ?
etc.

I know I just asked a lot of questions that might be difficult to answer, but I appreciate any information.
...and if anyone wants to add anything I didn't think to ask that would be great too.

Thanks

 

[MasterInstructor]

Any info on the above post would be appreciated...

 

[aesop081]

"Navel op trades" ?

Thats a new one......

 

[MasterInstructor]

Well, I did not start the thread.. I am just looking for NES Op...  ;D

 

[CallOfDuty]

  Hey MasterInst.  I can help a little.  Nesop progression is not unlike most ncm trades.  Do your 3's....get your NETP done...go to your ship to do your 4's package, which should be anywhere from a year to two.  Then get on your 5's course.....finish it, go back to ship.  Start spec pay.
  Remember PLQ is not guaranteed.  If after you are a leading seaman for a couple of years and show you have the interest and motivation to move up the ranks...you will.  If not, you can stay a LS. 
  A good buddy of mine got his  Masters with 7 years as a nesop. 
PS----after you've been posted to ship for too long your career manager may decide to post you to shore...for quality of life reasons.  For nesops, that shore posting is usually in an accomadations building with the stewards. 
  Good luck

 

[MasterInstructor]

Thanks a lot for the info! I am interested in PLQ for sure! MS in 7 years sounds very good Obviously it depends on performance but at least there is a possibility for those who deserve it.

I think I would be happy with a ship posting for most my career... Lets say until I reach 45, which is far far away

It is nice to get away from home sometimes  8) plus cant complain about Sea Duty Allowance....

cheers 

 

[willellis]

Hey guys, just want to know how long the 5s course might be. Just out of shear curiosity.

 

[MasterInstructor]

Hey guys, just want to know how long the 5s course might be. Just out of shear curiosity.

I am wondering the same...

Sounds like 4s course is done while posted to ship... Kind of like internship?

5s course sound more like a classroom setting?
If so, is it in Esquimalt?
How long is it?
How hard is it to get on the course? Wait time?


I am far far away from 5s but mine is shear curiosity too... I am leaving for BMQ soon...
cheers

 

[CallOfDuty]

as far as I can tell from forces.ca the ql3 is done in BC.....
   

"# Basic Occupational Qualification Training
The NES OP then attends the Canadian Forces Fleet School in Esquimalt, British Columbia for Naval Electronic Sensor Operator Qualification 3 course, which takes approximately 20 weeks and includes the following topics:
# Procedures for maintaining classified material
# Procedures for conducting intelligence and evidence gathering
# Basic radar and radio theory
# Electronic warfare equipment operation and checks
# Electronic emission classification
# Internal and external radio communications procedures"

  I'm pretty sure the 5's course is in Halifax though.  Anyone in the know...correct me if I'm wrong.

  After BMQ....do your 3's...go to ship...get your 4's package done....roughly a year or so...........then to your 5's.  Mostly classroom.
Cheers

 

[MasterInstructor]

as far as I can tell from forces.ca the ql3 is done in BC.....
   

"# Basic Occupational Qualification Training
The NES OP then attends the Canadian Forces Fleet School in Esquimalt, British Columbia for Naval Electronic Sensor Operator Qualification 3 course, which takes approximately 20 weeks and includes the following topics:
# Procedures for maintaining classified material
# Procedures for conducting intelligence and evidence gathering
# Basic radar and radio theory
# Electronic warfare equipment operation and checks
# Electronic emission classification
# Internal and external radio communications procedures"

  I'm pretty sure the 5's course is in Halifax though.  Anyone in the know...correct me if I'm wrong.

  After BMQ....do your 3's...go to ship...get your 4's package done....roughly a year or so...........then to your 5's.  Mostly classroom.
Cheers

Cheers! QL3 is easy to find info about... Its 4s and 5s that are harder to find info about... But thanks, we will see if anybody says something else. Halifax would be cool for a while... I am hoping to get posted to Esquimalt as I am from Vancouver. Do you have any idea how long 5s take? 1 Month? 6 Months?

 

[hugh19]

Their is no more 4's package. It is now a FC operator course in Halifax. Also the 5's has been split into an A and B level course.

 

[MasterInstructor]

Their is no more 4's package. It is now a FC operator course in Halifax. Also the 5's has been split into an A and B level course.

If you could elaborate a bit more it would be great! Such as length and location for 5s and FC Operator course.. Thanks!

EDIT:

Or you could maybe tell me how I can get this information? Online resource? Who to talk to?

 

[gcclarke]

The CFNOS intranet site outlines the following courses:

Junior Electronic Sensor Operator (QL4) - 11 Weeks: This course is designed to provide basic indoctrination training to the DP1 Level Jnr ES OP. Emphasis is placed on developing skill and knowledge required to operate Fire control systems (FCO).

Intermediate Electronic Sensor Operator (QL5A) - 15 Weeks: This course is designed to provide advance training to DP2 level NESOP. Emphasis is placed on developing skills and knowledge required to conduct ELINT analysis.

Fire Control Supervisor (QL5B) - (It didn't specify course length, but by looking at the QSP, it specified a reccomended 141 days of instruction, so at least 28 weeks, likely with a bit of flex time built in for stat holidays, divisions, admin, sports, etc): This course is designed to provide training to Naval Electronic Sensor Operators to perform the duties of Fire Control Supervisor, Ship’s Senior Analyst and CHAFF Supervisor within a Ship’s Combat Department. This qualification represents entry into Developmental Period Three (DP3).

The site is located here: http://halifax.mil.ca/N1/CFNOS/Courses/NESOP.htm#FCO

Edit: Oh and these are all in Halifax.

 

[CallOfDuty]

eeek....Stadacona.  :-X  Just kidding.  Arent NESOPS required to spend 50% of the time in the classroom and then the other 50% percent split between Tim Hortons and the Fleet club??  ;D
Cheers

 

[MasterInstructor]

Thank you so much! Exactly what I was looking for and more!

cheers