MATA and PATA ( Parental Leave )

[DAA]

I don't recall reading any of that.  Do you have a reference that you could share?

PM me your DWAN email address and I will send it right over......

 

[Strike]

PM me your DWAN email address and I will send it right over......

Just post the reference here.  I can check what it says when I get back to work tomorrow.

 

[Shamrock]

 

[DAA]

Just post the reference here.  I can check what it says when I get back to work tomorrow.

Okay, here goes.....extract from an email sent from DMCPG

Ref: ADM (HR) Mil Instr 20/04  http://cmp-cpm.forces.mil.ca/mpi-ipm/20-04-eng.asp

Thanks, I was aware of the CBI ref and agree it's specifically about pay increments but it's probably the best I could offer as well.  At ref is a Primary Reserve statement on the issue - See Section 3.11(d).  Excused Duty and Training (ED&T) is the P Res equivalent to the Reg F LWOP since they have no LWOP.  Unfortunately there's no similar statement anywhere that I can find for the Reg F.  QR&O 3.09 (3)(d) indicates periods of LWOP do not count for seniority.  That article will be amended in support of a new series of DAODs that will replace the various CFAOs dealing with Career Policy to include wording to the effect that, seniority does not accrue while on periods of LWOP except when it is taken for purposes of maternity/parental leave. 

With that said, option c from your previous e-mail is correct:

c. effective date of promotion changes to the first working day following parental leave.  (PARENTAL LEAVE COUNTS AS QUALIFYING SERVICE BUT THE MEMBER CANNOT HAVE AN EFFECTIVE DATE OF PROMOTION WHILE HE IS ON PARENTAL LEAVE).

From your previous e-mail, there's an explanation in the chain regarding deferral  "The basis for deferral of the promotion is that a mbr on MATA/PATA leave is not fulfilling a service requirement requiring the higher rank. " New policy (due out in 2012) will allow that the mbr's seniority could be backdated to 25 Mar but the effective date of promotion would still be 27 Mar, the day the mbr returned from parental leave.

I hope this clarifies.

 

[Strike]

So, I found this online:

http://cmp-cpm.forces.mil.ca/DHRIM/mhrrp/Ch17/engraph/ch17_e.pdf

which is basically a 'how-to' on administrating people who are pregnant or on MATA/PATA.

Paras 9.7-9.9 deal will promotions and pay scales while on MATA/PATA.

Promotion – MATA/PATA
9.7 Once a member has commenced LWOP for maternity or parental leave purposes, they are not rendering any service and should, therefore, not be entitled to promotion. However, promotions received while a member is on MATA/PATA may be deferred as long as they met all the prerequisites for promotion prior to commencing this leave and the promotion was previously approved, both for Reg and Res Forces. Of note, if a member is proceeding on PATA leave (vs MATA), his/her med cat doesn't change.

9.8 Promotion ceremonies are not considered to meet the exigencies of imperative military requirements. COs are cautioned that to recall a member from leave so as to promote the member amongst his/her peers will negatively affect the calculation of EI or QPIP benefits and MATA and/or PATA.
Promotions and Pay Incentives

9.9 A promotion affecting pay and allowances or a pay incentive awarded during the period used to calculate the member’s earnings prior to the CF member going on maternity or parental leave will affect the calculation of EI or QPIP benefits and MATA and/or PATA. The member’s URS is responsible to action any promotions and/or incentive awards in HRMS, except that for:

a.Reg F members, HRMS will trigger pay and CCPS will automatically calculate any changes to a rate of pay and re-calculate all allowances. The responsibility of generating an amended ROE remains with the member’s URS; and

b. Res F members, the Res F Admin HQ will need to enter the change in RPSR and issue an amended ROE if required. They must also advise DMPAP/Mil Pay Ops of the change of pay so that DMPAP may re-calculate the MATA and/or PATA.

I've highlighted the 'should' as anyone who has spent way too much time looking through regs and pubs knows that 'should' does not mean 'shall.'  Therefore, someone could conceivably be promoted while on MATA/PATA (and it has been done).  It would wreak havock when trying to recalculate benefits though, which is one of the reasons it's not recommended.

 

[Strike]

So, currently on sick leave from delivering via c-section until 24 Oct when Mata is suposed to start. Now, the little one is still in the hospital being 2 months premature.

I've read QR&O 16.26 and 16.27 (on an iPhone so forgive me if I don't post the ref) and it's my understanding that, because my baby was in hospital prior to both Mata or Parental starting, the end dates of those leave will be extended accordingly. For example, if she's in for 4 weeks total then maternity and parental leave will end later so that the effect is that I still get a full year of having her at home.

Am I correct in my thinking? I have to go in to work to sort out some of this admin and want to make sure I have my references down. The last time I went the clerks were under the impression that my year away from work started from her birth date even though she is in the hospital. I know that the public service doesn't start the year of Mata/Pata until baby is at home according to another parent who's little one is also in the NICU here.

 

[Cansky]

Although my premie daughter was born 10 years ago and things could have changed since then, my mata and pata started from the time she was born.  Same for the next 2 children.  Your sick leave which is standard for all pregnancy's only affects our pay not the time you'll spend away from work unless you sick leave was prior to delivery which is another separate issue. However I could be wrong as it has been a number of years since my girls were born.

 

[Strike]

Back home now and have the relevant references, with the paras in question highlighted.  (Some of the formatting may be off due to trying to cut and paste on an iPad.)

16.26 - MATERNITY LEAVE

(1) (Application) This article applies to an officer or non-commissioned member of the Regular Force or the Reserve Force on Class "B" or "C" Reserve Service.

(2) (Definition) In this article, "maternity leave" means a period of leave without pay and allowances granted to an officer or non-commissioned member for maternity purposes. (20 July 2006)

(3) (Eligibility) An officer or non-commissioned member who has been pregnant for at least 19 weeks is entitled, on request, to maternity leave for a period of up to the sum of the applicable periods of entitlement referred to in CBI subparagraph 205.461(4)(a) (Maternity and Parental Allowances) and paragraph 205.461(7). (20 July 2006)

(4) (Start and End of Period) Subject to paragraphs (5), (7) and (8), the period of maternity leave shall not start more than 8 weeks before the expected date of birth and shall end not later than 18 weeks after the date of the end of the pregnancy. (20 July 2006)

(5) (Extension) The end date of the period of maternity leave shall be extended by any of the following periods: (20 July 2006)

any period during which one or more new-born children are hospitalized, if the officer or non-commissioned member has not yet started the period of the maternity leave; and (20 July 2006)
any period during which the officer or non-commissioned member, having started but not ended the period of the maternity leave, returns to duty while one or more new-born children are hospitalized. (20 July 2006)
(6) (Military Requirements) When an officer or non-commissioned member has started but not ended maternity leave, a commanding officer may direct that the member return to duty because of imperative military requirements.

(7) (Maternity Benefits Extended) If a period of maternity benefits received under the Employment Insurance Act, or a provincial law or scheme, is extended in accordance with the Employment Insurance Act or the provincial law or scheme because the officer or non-commissioned member returns to duty under paragraph (6), the end date of the period of maternity leave granted shall be extended by the period that the maternity benefits are extended under the applicable law or scheme. (20 July 2006)

(8) (Limitation) A period of maternity leave extended under paragraphs (5) or (7) shall not end later than 52 weeks after the date of the end of the pregnancy.

(M) (20 July 2006)

16.27 - PARENTAL LEAVE

(1) (Application) This article applies to an officer or non-commissioned member of the Regular Force or the Reserve Force on Class  "B" or "C" Reserve Service.

(2) (Definition) In this article, "parental leave" means a period of leave without pay and allowances granted to an officer or non-commissioned member for parental or paternity purposes relating to one or more new-born or adopted children or children to be adopted. (20 July 2006)

(3) (Eligibility) An officer or non-commissioned member is entitled to parental leave, on request, if the member: (20 July 2006)

has the care and custody of one or more new-born children of the member; (20 July 2006)
starts legal proceedings under the laws of a province to adopt one or more children who are placed with the member for the purpose of adoption; or (20 July 2006)
obtains an order under the laws of a province for the adoption of one or more children. (20 July 2006)
(4) (Period of Leave) The period of parental leave is up to:
(20 July 2006)

a period of 37 weeks; or (20 July 2006) (20 July 2006)
if the officer or non-commissioned member is entitled to a period of leave under article 16.26 (Maternity Leave), a period of the sum of the applicable periods of entitlement referred to in CBI subparagraph 205.461(4)(b) (Maternity and Parental Allowances) and paragraph 205.461(7). (20 July 2006)
(5) (Start and End of Period) The period of parental leave shall be taken within 52 weeks of the day on which the child or children of the officer or non-commissioned member are born or the day on which the member first became entitled to parental leave under subparagraph (3)(b) or (c).
(20 July 2006)

(6) (Extension) The end date of the period of parental leave shall be extended by any of the following periods: (20 July 2006)

any period during which one or more new-born or adopted children or children to be adopted are hospitalized, if the officer or non-commissioned member has not yet started the period of the parental leave; (20 July 2006)
any period during which the officer or non-commissioned member, having started but not ended the period of the parental leave, returns to duty while one or more new-born or adopted children or children to be adopted are hospitalized; and (20 July 2006)
any period during which the officer or non-commissioned member, having started but not ended the period of the parental leave, is directed to return to duty by the commanding officer because of imperative military requirements. (20 July 2006)
(7) (Limitation) A period of parental leave

extended under subparagraph 6(a) or 6(b) shall end no later than 52 weeks after the day on which the officer or non-commissioned member first becomes entitled to parental leave under paragraph (3); or
extended under subparagraph 6(c) or deferred under paragraph (8) shall end no later than 104 weeks after the day on which the officer or non-commissioned member first becomes entitled to parental leave under paragraph (3).
(8) (Military Requirements) A commanding officer may defer the start date of the period of parental leave if there are military imperative requirements.

(9) (Combined Periods - Parental Reasons) Subject to paragraph (10), if both parents are members of the Canadian Forces, the sum of the periods of parental leave to which the parents are entitled under this article, or the sum of the periods of parental leave under this article and any exemption from duty and training under article 9.10 (Exemption from Duty and Training - Parental Purposes) to which the parents are entitled, shall not exceed 37 weeks. (20 July 2006)

(10) (Combined Periods - Parental and Maternity Reasons) If both parents are members of the Canadian Forces and one parent is entitled to an exemption from duty and training under article 9.09 (Exemption From Duty and Training - Maternity Purposes) or is entitled to maternity leave under article 16.26, the sum of the period of exemption from duty and training under article 9.09 or maternity leave under article 16.26 to which a parent is entitled, and the periods of parental leave under this article and any exemption from duty and training under article 9.10 to which the parents are entitled, shall not exceed 52 weeks. (20 July 2006)

(11) (Transitional) The end date of the period of parental leave for an officer or non-commissioned member to whom section 4 of the Fairness for Military Families (Employment Insurance) Act applies is extended in the same manner as the period referred to in subsection 23(2) of the Employment Insurance Act as determined by the application of that section.

 

[datrembl118]

Is anybody know if after taking a year of parental leave, those a member still required a annual PER of just a PDR?

 

[Cansky]

An annual PER.  If you worked less than 3 months of the year it will be an exemption PER reflecting parental leave and if you worked more than 3 months then its an annual PER.  This is all explained in the CPAS.

 

[Infanteer]

IIRC, CFPAS doesn't say three months, it says an observable period.  If you come back after MATA/PATA and do 2 months of decent work, you should get a PER.

 

[armyvern]

Depends upon whether or not they worked for an observable time period during the annual PER reporting period; if no, then they'd receive a PER Exemption (that form can be found within CFPAS) - all specific dates covering the entire reporting period are required to be entered etc with an explanation of why mbr was not observable for that time.

Last year, I belonged to my Unit for 4 months, but spent all but 1 week on embarkation or disembarkation leave.  No PER.  I did get an exemption PER that covered 01 Apr-06 Apr (exempt due to predeployment leave), 07 Apr- 17 Dec (exempt due to being deployed), 18-21 Dec (worked 3 X 1/2 days), 22 Dec - 21 Mar (exempt due to post-deployment leave), 22 -31 Mar - worked.

 

[armyvern]

IIRC, CFPAS doesn't say three months, it says an observable period.  If you come back after MATA/PATA and do 2 months of decent work, you should get a PER.

You're right.  We've had troops who worked 5 weeks during the year due to deployments, but they got a PER from us because they were at work and observable.

 

[DAA]

Is anybody know if after taking a year of parental leave, those a member still required a annual PER of just a PDR?

Tons of factors to consider when deciding to either write a PER or a PERX, such as:

a.  are you an NCM or an Offr?
b.  how long have you been in your unit and or job?
c.  how long of an observation period does the supervisor have to work with?
d.  if the observation period is limited, would a full PER disadvantage the member? (ie; low score due to lack of substantiation)
e.  would a PERX disadvantage the member? (ie; can you substantiate a higher than normal scoring)

Every situation is different, with one exception!  You should receive something that will ultimately be forwarded to your CM.

 

[chriscalow]

I see on my pay stub I pay approx 300 to CF superannuation, in addition to CPP and EI payments. Are all three deductions ceased on mata/pata, requiring re-payment, or is it just the CPP/EI?

Thanks.

 

[CountDC]

Interesting - when I did my pata the canex payment continued to come out.  The mata/pata clk took it into account when she did my pay.

EI can be filed online and then you just drop off the form and your nearest office.  I did my last one that way and didn't have to go through the long waiting period. i was shocked that the money was in my account right on time.

 

[Strike]

Since this seems to be the thread for Mata/Pata pay hopefully someone will be able to help me out.

Just got my end Feb pay stub and noticed a significant drop in my Mata/Pata allowance.  Granted, I should be switching to Parental from Maternity this month, but it was my understanding that my pay should remain the same.  Is there some weird voodoo going on that I should be aware of?  Nobody's in the office right now so I can't call in.

 

[dapaterson]

Since this seems to be the thread for Mata/Pata pay hopefully someone will be able to help me out.

Just got my end Feb pay stub and noticed a significant drop in my Mata/Pata allowance.  Granted, I should be switching to Parental from Maternity this month, but it was my understanding that my pay should remain the same.  Is there some weird voodoo going on that I should be aware of?  Nobody's in the office right now so I can't call in.

Were I a betting man I'd assume that the MATA has expired, and the PATA hasn't been activated in the pay system yet.  I believe it's two different transactions, one to activate each.

 

[Strike]

Were I a betting man I'd assume that the MATA has expired, and the PATA hasn't been activated in the pay system yet.  I believe it's two different transactions, one to activate each.

Thanks DP.  Turns out that's what it is and, because the date for the changover is wonky, this month may be a tad lean.  Next month will make up for it though.

 

[63 Delta]

My wife came off Mata in Feb. She was at minimum overpaid $700. We are told that the Help desk in Ottawa is the only who can deal with this. Its over two and a half months, and they still havent taken her pay back.

Anyone know how long the help desk usually takes? And why is Ottawa the only one able to help with a MATA over-payment? Seems like an extra layer of unneeded bureaucracy... Maybe thats why there are so many pers at NDHQ...