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Justin Trudeau hints at boosting Canada’s military spending

Justin Trudeau hints at boosting Canada’s military spending

Canada says it will look at increasing its defence spending and tacked on 10 more Russian names to an ever growing sanctions list.

By Tonda MacCharles
Ottawa Bureau
Mon., March 7, 2022

Riga, LATVIA—On the 13th day of the brutal Russian bid to claim Ukraine as its own, Prime Minister Justin Trudeau is showing up at the Latvian battle group led by Canadian soldiers, waving the Maple Leaf and a vague hint at more money for the military.

Canada has been waving the NATO flag for nearly seven years in Latvia as a bulwark against Russia’s further incursions in Eastern Europe.

Canada stepped up to lead one of NATO’s four battle groups in 2015 — part of the defensive alliance’s display of strength and solidarity with weaker member states after Russia invaded Ukraine and seized the Crimean peninsula in 2014. Trudeau arrived in the Latvian capital late Monday after meetings in the U.K. with British Prime Minister Boris Johnson and Netherlands Prime Minister Mark Rutte.

Earlier Monday, faced with a seemingly unstoppable war in Ukraine, Trudeau said he will look at increasing Canada’s defence spending. Given world events, he said there are “certainly reflections to have.”

And Canada tacked on 10 more Russian names to an ever-growing sanctions list.

The latest round of sanctions includes names Trudeau said were identified by jailed Russian opposition leader and Putin nemesis Alexei Navalny.

However, on a day when Trudeau cited the new sanctions, and Johnson touted new measures meant to expose Russian property owners in his country, Rutte admitted sanctions are not working.

Yet they all called for more concerted international efforts over the long haul, including more economic measures and more humanitarian aid, with Johnson and Rutte divided over how quickly countries need to get off Russian oil and gas.

The 10 latest names on Canada’s target list do not include Roman Abramovich — a Russian billionaire Navalny has been flagging to Canada since at least 2017. Canada appears to have sanctioned about 20 of the 35 names on Navalny’s list.

The Conservative opposition says the Liberal government is not yet exerting maximum pressure on Putin, and should do more to bolster Canadian Forces, including by finally approving the purchase of fighter jets.

Foreign affairs critic Michael Chong said in an interview that Ottawa must still sanction “additional oligarchs close to President Putin who have significant assets in Canada.”

Abramovich owns more than a quarter of the public shares in steelmaking giant Evraz, which has operations in Alberta and Saskatchewan and has supplied most of the steel for the government-owned Trans Mountain pipeline project.

Evraz’s board of directors also includes two more Russians the U.S. government identified as “oligarchs” in 2019 — Aleksandr Abramov and Aleksandr Frolov — and its Canadian operations have received significant support from the federal government.

That includes at least $27 million in emergency wage subsidies during the pandemic, as well as $7 million through a fund meant to help heavy-polluters reduce emissions that cause climate change, according to the company’s most recent annual report.

In addition to upping defence spending, the Conservatives want NORAD’s early warning system upgraded, naval shipbuilding ramped up and Arctic security bolstered.

In London, Johnson sat down with Trudeau and Rutte at the Northolt airbase. Their morning meetings had a rushed feel, with Johnson starting to usher press out before Trudeau spoke. His office said later that the British PM couldn’t squeeze the full meeting in at 10 Downing Street because Johnson’s “diary” was so busy that day. The three leaders held an afternoon news conference at 10 Downing.

But before that Trudeau met with the Queen, saying she was “insightful” and they had a “useful, for me anyway, conversation about global affairs.”

Trudeau meets with NATO Secretary General Jens Stoltenberg Tuesday in Latvia.

The prime minister will also meet with three Baltic leaders, the prime ministers of Latvia, Lithuania and Estonia, in the Latvian capital of Riga.

The Liberals announced they would increase the 500 Canadian Forces in Latvia by another 460 troops. The Canadians are leading a multinational battle group, one of four that are part of NATO’s deployments in the region.

Another 3,400 Canadians could be deployed to the region in the months to come, on standby for NATO orders.

But Canada’s shipments of lethal aid to Ukraine were slow to come in the view of the Conservatives, and the Ukrainian Canadian community.

And suddenly Western allies are eyeing each other’s defence commitments.

At the Downing Street news conference, Rutte noted the Netherlands will increase its defence budget to close to two per cent of GDP. Germany has led the G7, and doubled its defence budget in the face of Putin’s invasion and threats. Johnson said the U.K. defence spending is about 2.4 per cent and declined to comment on Canada’s defence spending which is 1.4 per cent of GDP.

But Johnson didn’t hold back.

“What we can’t do, post the invasion of Ukraine is assume that we go back to a kind of status quo ante, a kind of new normalization in the way that we did after the … seizure of Crimea and the Donbas area,” Johnson said. “We’ve got to recognize that things have changed and that we need a new focus on security and I think that that is kind of increasingly understood by everybody.”

Trudeau stood by his British and Dutch counterparts and pledged Canada would do more.

He defended his government’s record, saying Ottawa is gradually increasing spending over the next decade by 70 per cent. Then Trudeau admitted more might be necessary.

“We also recognize that context is changing rapidly around the world and we need to make sure that women and men have certainty and our forces have all the equipment necessary to be able to stand strongly as we always have. As members of NATO. We will continue to look at what more we can do.”

The three leaders — Johnson, a conservative and Trudeau and Rutte, progressive liberals — in a joint statement said they “will continue to impose severe costs on Russia.”

Arriving for the news conference from Windsor Castle, Trudeau had to detour to enter Downing Street as loud so-called Freedom Convoy protesters bellowed from outside the gate. They carried signs marked “Tuck Frudeau” and “Free Tamara” (Lich).

Protester Jeff Wyatt who said he has no Canadian ties told the Star he came to stand up for Lich and others who were leading a “peaceful protest” worldwide against government “lies” about COVID-19 and what he called Trudeau’s “tyranny.”

Elsewhere in London, outside the Russian embassy, other protesters and passersby reflected on what they said was real tyranny — the Russian attack on Ukraine. “I think we should be as tough as possible to get this stopped, as tough as possible,” said protester Clive Martinez.
 
This is about people being organized to do what they can when they can as johnny on the spot.

Sure, and I see it in video and stills every time there is some kind of emergency : locals (mostly) showing up and doing stuff. And then the army shows up and does the same stuff, which I'm not convinced is actually necessary except as a matter of reassuring those who need reassurance. The CAF brings useful skill sets, but mostly those are not the ones that are going to be taught to part-timers.

People showing up to learn stuff still costs money, and I'm unconvinced there's much return on investment if they don't actually show up for the real thing.

[Add: there is a potential positive point; if they show up at existing armouries then it will only be a matter of time before the idea of having a mess open on Home Guard Night occurs to someone. So it might improve mess revenues.]
 
This is about people being organized to do what they can when they can as johnny on the spot. Even if it is just forming bucket brigades until the professionals come to save them. With any luck they might have put the fire out before they get their.

And yes Denmark has professional Emergency Services as well.

But still people volunteer...

And others still join the army.

A bigger (per capita) and better equipped army than we provide.
Denmark has lots of people with a living connection to a time their country was occupied by a foreign invader, that tends to inspire people to care about defending their country in a way Canadians don't.

Sure, and I see it in video and stills every time there is some kind of emergency : locals (mostly) showing up and doing stuff. And then the army shows up and does the same stuff, which I'm not convinced is actually necessary except as a matter of reassuring those who need reassurance. The CAF brings useful skill sets, but mostly those are not the ones that are going to be taught to part-timers.

People showing up to learn stuff still costs money, and I'm unconvinced there's much return on investment if they don't actually show up for the real thing.

[Add: there is a potential positive point; if they show up at existing armouries then it will only be a matter of time before the idea of having a mess open on Home Guard Night occurs to someone. So it might improve mess revenues.]
The last thing the CAF needs is more people coming into the messes to drink, and misbehave.
 
Sure, and I see it in video and stills every time there is some kind of emergency : locals (mostly) showing up and doing stuff. And then the army shows up and does the same stuff, which I'm not convinced is actually necessary except as a matter of reassuring those who need reassurance. The CAF brings useful skill sets, but mostly those are not the ones that are going to be taught to part-timers.

This Home Guard organization is about exactly that. Organizing those people that would show up in any case and making them more useful.

And I agree that most of the time the Army's contribution is a photo-op rather than meaningfully changing the course of the event. That usually gets done locally. We agree.


People showing up to learn stuff still costs money, and I'm unconvinced there's much return on investment if they don't actually show up for the real thing.

Yes it does. We spend something like 215 million dollars annually doing exactly that for 60,000 13 to 18 year olds in the Cadets and Junior Rangers.

This programme in essence is continuation of the Cadet programme. Cadets, or as was said, Boy Scouts for adults. The Danes spend, in equivalent terms, 650 million dollars for 326,000 willing adults. We spend 1,500 million, 1.5 billion, on Canadian Heritage. Use some of that budget.

[Add: there is a potential positive point; if they show up at existing armouries then it will only be a matter of time before the idea of having a mess open on Home Guard Night occurs to someone. So it might improve mess revenues.]

Turn it into an Aussie Legion.
 
Continuing with my fascination on the subject of Denmark

We have 7x the population but only 5x the wealth. Rich Danish buggers.

With that I took a look at the kit the Danes have and multiplied it by 5.

We would end up with

95x Cesar 155mm SPH (Wheeled)
105x LAV mounted 120mm mortars
220x Leo2A7
220x CV9035
2200x LAVs
890x Armoured HMMWV
75x Jackal

The Navy would end up with

15x Iver Huitfeldt Air Defence Frigates (ABM/Tomahawk Capable)
10x Absalon ASW/Support Frigates (Tank Transport Capable)
20x Thetis Class Frigates
15x Knud Rasmussen Patrol Vessels

The Air Force would end up with

163x F16 (being phased out)
135x F35 (being phased in)
20x Challenger MPA
20x C130J
55x Fennec Helicopters
45x SH-60
70x Merlin/Cormorant

40x NASAMS AD Batteries with 240x launchers
30x Radar Stations

All with a budget of less than 2% of GDP. (1.6 to be precise)
Where the eff do they park them all, glorified City State
 
Agreed, in Alberta we need to provide 30 days written notice including date we leave and date we will return. Army changes course dates on you less than 30 days out? Well good luck to you cause bow your employer can just say no, and not keep your job.
On that point, an employer might be fine losing a volunteer FD employee for the afternoon. But I know that same employer isn’t so keen on losing a volunteer GSAR employee for a few days to look for a missing hiker/skier/hunter/mushroom picker.

Add to that the calls usually come at 8 pm on a Sunday night, it’s hard to find and retain volunteers for anything because of life.
 
Where the eff do they park them all, glorified City State

In fairness, that is IF we bought at the same rate that they bought. Divide those numbers by find and park them in Nova Scotia and you aren't far off their reality.

We might have to encroach on New Brunswick
 
Continuing with my fascination on the subject of Denmark

We have 7x the population but only 5x the wealth. Rich Danish buggers.

With that I took a look at the kit the Danes have and multiplied it by 5.

We would end up with

95x Cesar 155mm SPH (Wheeled)
105x LAV mounted 120mm mortars
220x Leo2A7
220x CV9035
2200x LAVs
890x Armoured HMMWV
75x Jackal

The Navy would end up with

15x Iver Huitfeldt Air Defence Frigates (ABM/Tomahawk Capable)
10x Absalon ASW/Support Frigates (Tank Transport Capable)
20x Thetis Class Frigates
15x Knud Rasmussen Patrol Vessels

The Air Force would end up with

163x F16 (being phased out)
135x F35 (being phased in)
20x Challenger MPA
20x C130J
55x Fennec Helicopters
45x SH-60
70x Merlin/Cormorant

40x NASAMS AD Batteries with 240x launchers
30x Radar Stations

All with a budget of less than 2% of GDP. (1.6 to be precise)

Denmark is the cork in Russia's Baltic bottle, so no surprise really.
 
Denmark is the cork in Russia's Baltic bottle, so no surprise really.

The surprise is that they can get the job done for less than 2% of GDP.

We would end up with

95x Cesar 155mm SPH (Wheeled) - vs 37x M777
105x LAV mounted 120mm mortars - vs 0x
220x Leo2A7 - vs 80x various
220x CV9035 - vs 0x
2200x LAVs - vs 900x various
890x Armoured HMMWV - vs 500x TAPV
75x Jackal - ???

The Navy would end up with

15x Iver Huitfeldt Air Defence Frigates (ABM/Tomahawk Capable) - vs 12x CPF
10x Absalon ASW/Support Frigates (Tank Transport Capable) - vs 0x
20x Thetis Class Frigates - vs 0x
15x Knud Rasmussen Patrol Vessels - vs 14x AOPV/MCDV

The Air Force would end up with

163x F16 (being phased out) - vs 80?x F18
135x F35 (being phased in) - vs who knows what who knows when
20x Challenger MPA - vs 14?x CP140
20x C130J - vs 17x?
55x Fennec Helicopters vs 85x Griffon
45x SH-60 - vs 24x Cyclone
70x Merlin/Cormorant - vs 14x Cormorant

40x NASAMS AD Batteries with 240x launchers - vs 0x
30x Radar Stations

All with a budget of less than 2% of GDP. (1.6 to be precise)

To be fair we do have some C17s, CH47s, some tankers and 4 slightly used subs as well.
 
Problem is training courses aren't two weeks, hell mine were 3 months, had to switch jobs many tines because employeers didn't like playing ball, and it's not worth filing a complaint

Right.

Which is why those three full summers of PRes training during high school helped prepare for when full-time training was reduced to two weeks every summer.

That's why one should concentrate on students, and train the hell out of them for the full summers when they are looking for work anyway.

In three summers and two academic years (five summers and four years for officers and certain others) you should be able to get them BMQ, DP1 and 2 trained in whatever trade. After that you go on a reduced cycle of obligatory training which caters for outside work and the family.
 
Right.

Which is why those three full summers of PRes training during high school helped prepare for when training was reduced to two weeks every summer.
I remember back when I joined, we had QL2 and QL3. They’d run both courses essentially back to back during the summers, so a brand new recruit was an employable private by the time he/she went back to their unit.

I scratch my head at how long courses are now, and yet it still seems to take longer to bring a recruit up to basic qualified standard than it used to.

3 full summers? I don’t even know if many would still be motivated. I don’t think I would be.

Same with recruiting.
 
Comparing a Danish-type Home Guard with some kind of pan-Canadian national volunteer force strikes me as a bit problematic. We don't have the history that inspired their creation of their Home Guard. What is being exampled for our volunteer forces sounds like it would include few if any skills that would be useful to a military service should the need arise.

The numbers quoted for volunteerism is Canada is impressive, but it is such a broad category. Elderly retirees helping out at a blood clinic are difficult to compare with a volunteer firefighter if, for no other reason, there are provincial standards for fire services. Even at that, Ontario is proposing a system of certification for VFFs, which departments are concerned will crater their staff. In our area, fire services are having difficulty in attracting volunteers. It seems most local employers are pretty good about it, but unless you are employed locally, you're not much help. Many folks in rural areas travel a lot farther for work now and many rural areas are 'graying-out'. Response time is important. It's one thing to organize a bag-filling team for tomorrow than it is to staff a truck to head to a burning house RFN.

For such a volunteer force, what is the hook? Helping your community? You need to be lot more specific because things like training, risk and personal interest are important. Someone interested in GSAR might not want to pull mangled bodies out of a car wreck. Someone willing to fill sandbags might not be physically able to stomp through the bush. Someone willing to show up and help shelter evacuees probably isn't at risk of hurting themselves or others.

I have been both a volunteer and 'managed' volunteers (term used very loosely - it's often like herding cats). If the goal is to fill sandbags, the person who hasn't shown for training in a year but seems to know which end of a shovel to hold will probably work, but I wouldn't send them into a burning house or drop them in the deep bush with a pump. Sometimes good intentions are all you need - sometimes not.

I just don't see how some all-singin'all-dansin' highly-trained-but-still-generalist group of domestic volunteers would somehow adequately address our domestic emergency needs and still somehow be an adjunct to the military. Although I don't know much about them, are even the Canadian Rangers trained in some level of military tactical skills, other than perhaps some range work with their finally-new rifles?
 
3 full summers? I don’t even know if many would still be motivated. I don’t think I would be.

High school students can join PRes when 16 ( with parental consent ), as I and others did.

After that you go on a reduced cycle of obligatory training which caters for outside work and the family.

Or, wait to join the PRes until after graduation, and hope your employer is agreeable to giving you time off for your part-time job.

From this super-thread, and others like it, YMMV from employer to employer.


Some reservists I knew were marginally employed, so time off worked out ok for them.
 
Comparing a Danish-type Home Guard with some kind of pan-Canadian national volunteer force strikes me as a bit problematic. We don't have the history that inspired their creation of their Home Guard. What is being exampled for our volunteer forces sounds like it would include few if any skills that would be useful to a military service should the need arise.

I've worked with the Danish Home Guard, and the Norwegian equivalent, on various NATO exercises.

There is no way that they are anything like our reservists, who are trained to the same standards - ish as the Reg F to facilitate augmentation etc.

They are good at what they are intended to do: fight a defensive battle - within about 1 km of their homes - for key points like bridges etc. as a delaying tactic to enable mobilization to successfully take place before the Russians roll through.

We can see some of this playing out in the Ukraine right now, I believe, with their Home Guard equivalent.

A nation without the same threats of invasion and occupation by an overwhelmingly powerful and aggressive neighbour, that happens to have armoured divisions a mere couple of hour's drive from their capital, has no need for such a force.
 
A nation without the same threats of invasion and occupation by an overwhelmingly powerful and aggressive neighbor, that happens to have armored, Light and Medium divisions a mere couple of hour's drive from their capital, has no need for such a force.
Fixed the spelling of neighbor, and for our Armored Divs and added some of the other forces ;)
 
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