In Afghan fields the poppies grow

[MarkOttawa]

Doug Saunders of the Globe and Mail reports an allegation that Canada's involvement in Afstan is as futile as the Battle of Passchendaele. What despicable journalism. Talk about fixing things for the agenda.
http://www.rbcinvest.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/ArticleNews/PEstory/LAC/20070712/BATTLE12/International/international/internationalEuropeHeadline/1/1/2/

...Vimy offers the lesson that military sacrifice is worth it in the end. Passchendaele offers another, potentially relevant lesson: that military endeavours are enormously wasteful if they serve no greater end.

"I think that the lesson of Passchendaele is that when you enter a war, there have to be clear objectives - and in the heat of fighting, when you are losing many lives, it is very dangerous to lose sight of those objectives." Mr. Bostyn [curator of the Belgian-run Passchendaele museum] said. "It's a lesson that's being forgotten in Iraq and Afghanistan."..

In any event, the Allied and Associated Powers did win the First World War--after very short "negotiations" that led to a crushing armistice, and then a peace treaty which the Germans had no part in framing (whether that was a Good Thing is another matter, but Margaret MacMillan thinks Versailles was about the best that could be done at the time). You could look it up, Jack, instead of spouting this over-ripe tripe:
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/Page/document/v5/content/subscribe?user_URL=http://www.theglobeandmail.com%2Fservlet%2Fstory%2FRTGAM.20070704.waghanlayton07043%2FBNStory%2FNational&ord=7101964&brand=theglobeandmail&redirect_reason=2&denial_reasons=none&force_login=false

“Students of history will know that all major conflicts are resolved, ultimately, through peace-oriented discussions. . . . And that's what needs to happen here.”

Mark
Ottawa

 

[mover1]

Quoted fro the article

"While the Battle of Vimy Ridge is remembered as one of Canada's greatest military triumphs, the Battle of Passchendaele is considered one of Canada's most costly and brutal victories."

Vimy Ridge                                                Passchendaele
Dates April 9- 12, 1917                               July 31 - Nov. 10, 1917
Duration 4 days                                          103 days (Canadians led for the last 16 days)
Canadian troops involved 97,184                  100,000
Canadian casualties 10,602                         15,654
German casualties 20,000                           270,000
Victoria crosses earned 4                            9 "



Just to  pick some of the stats apart. Looking at the numbers and the dates to say that Passchendaele was a more brutal and bloody battle is silly.
It was longer by 99 days.
You can easily round up the Canadian numbers in Vimy to 100,000 just like the Passchendaele figures.
Both battles were very important in their ever lasting effects on the country and the world.  Vimy Forged a nation while Passchendalele was the inspiration for an entire world (Middle Earth's Mordor)
Passchendaeles reputation as a bloody comes more from the mud and conditions than anything else. The mud may have actually saved the lives of many service men from shrapnel, as artillery penetrated deep into the soil before detonation. (It saved my Great Uncle). While at the same time causing the deaths through Drowning and exhaustion of men caught in its quagmire.

This guys figures are weak and he  makes a poor argument to support his position.

 

[Brockvegas]

QUOTE
“Students of history will know that all major conflicts are resolved, ultimately, through peace-oriented discussions. . . . And that's what needs to happen here.”
UNQUOTE

Mark, while I agree that at some point we will need to discuss treaties, agreements, etc. now is not yet the time to do it.

First off, we can't sign treaties calling for peace in Afghanistan with their newly developing government, because that government does not YET control the people of their own country. I believe that, given enough time, they will control the whole of the country. Unfortunately in order for that to happen, they must (with our HELP) rid their country of the Taliban, the war/drug lords, and the inter-tribal hatred that plagues their country, and I for one believe that they can do it.

For a thousand years the people of Afghanistan have defended themselves against countries and invading armies HUNDREDS of times larger than them. There is absolutely no way that they can't defend themselves against a homegrown threat.

The only reason that the Taliban exists as it does in Afghanistan is explained using the "Boiling Frog Theory". (If you drop a frog into boiling water it will immediately jump out, but if you place it in cool water and slowly heat it up it will sit there and cook to death).

Had the Taliban been a massed invading force, the people of Afghanistan would have destroyrd them in a matter of months, a few years at the very longest. Unfortunately because the development of the Taliban was somewhat secretive, starting as a small group of people with extremist ideas, growing slowly over time, it has been allowed to grow into an international threat.

Don't get me wrong, that frog ain't cooked yet. The government of Afghanistan, and others, can still defeat them. It's just going to take a little longer now, a little more work.