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Grenade Machine Gun

Meh...

**** it.. I can‘t find the vid where a Mk19 mounted on a halftop Hummer is firing on a tank shell...

It was a gret vid.

Anyone have the link?
 
It was stated at the last gunnery conference, we will not call it a grenade machine gun. It will be designated an AGL (Automatic Grenade Launcher). This is the term that has already been applied to whatever weapon we purchase, in the Advanced Gunnery Modules. It will also NOT be the M19 or variants.
 
Originally posted by recceguy:
[qb] It was stated at the last gunnery conference, we will not call it a grenade machine gun. It will be designated an AGL (Automatic Grenade Launcher). This is the term that has already been applied to whatever weapon we purchase, in the Advanced Gunnery Modules. It will also NOT be the M19 or variants. [/qb]
The US is developing XM 307, a 25mm grenade launcher that weighs considerably less than the Mk 19 at 18.6 kg.

This system has a built in laser and fuze setting capability.

The next generation of personal small arms are supposed to mount a 25mm grenade launcher, vice an M203 40 mm, with the same fuse setting capability. Should be handy for airburst firing at targets behind cover.

One of these would sure be welcome and decidedly more man portable.
 
computer chips in grenades dosen‘t sound like a good idea.

whats wrong with the M-203 anyways?

also a quick question:

does anyone know if you can put the beehive (buckshot) rounds that the US used in the M-79 in Nam in the 203??
 
nothing‘s wrong with the m-203. nothing was wrong with the muzzle-loader musket either, but that got replaced too now didn‘t it.

computer chips in grenades sounds unsafe does it? better tell that to the guys who put them in ICBMS. they‘ll have to go back to gears and springs.
 
An Automatic Grenade Launcher is not made to replace an underbarrel grenade launcher its made to provide continous suppressive firepower that is more lethal then that of a GPMG or HMG.
 
Originally posted by Ex-Dragoon:
[qb] An Automatic Grenade Launcher is not made to replace an underbarrel grenade launcher its made to provide continous suppressive firepower that is more lethal then that of a GPMG or HMG. [/qb]
Absolutely.

My comment was directed toward the fact that the next generation of AGL is expected to be something along the lines of the XM307 AGL.

Mk 19 and variants, as well as other 40mm systems are great. They are becoming rather dated compared to some of the equipment being trialed and researched.

It just so happens that the future "underbarrel" grenade launcher is also expected to be 25 mm with the attributes as described previously (lasing, fuse setting).

It would make sense to buy the next generation of AGL at this point, not the outgoing generation. Obviously we would have to tie this into a small arms acquisition program.

http://www4.janes.com/K2/doc.jsp?t=Q&K2DocKey=/content1/janesdata/yb/jiw/jiw_0589.htm@current&QueryText=%3CAND%3E%28%3COR%3E%28%28%5B80%5Dxm307+%3CIN%3E+body%29%2C+%28%5B100%5D%28%5B100%5Dxm307+%3CIN%3E+title%29+%3CAND%3E+%28%5B100%5Dxm307+%3CIN%3E+body%29%29%29%29&Prod_Name=JIW&
 
Originally posted by 48Highlander:
[qb] nothing‘s wrong with the m-203. nothing was wrong with the muzzle-loader musket either, but that got replaced too now didn‘t it.

computer chips in grenades sounds unsafe does it? better tell that to the guys who put them in ICBMS. they‘ll have to go back to gears and springs. [/qb]
So you would like to carry an OCIW around?? Would you rather have an XM-8 with a fancy computer sight on the top with fancy computer chip grenades and such that runs on batterys and windows XP, then say an AK-74/GP-25(gren launcher designation is prolly wrong) that always shoots when you tell it too.
 
The current rendition of the OCIW is rather too large and bulky for most soldiers, but the 25mm OCSW is an interesting attempt to replace HMGs and AGLs with something lighter, more flexable and more lethal. I wonder if someone has had the bright idea to prototype a 25mm underbarrel grenade launcher using the OCSW round, along with a "stripped down" version of the electronic sight unit. This would be much lighter than the OCIW, and reduce the number of ammunition types in the Infantry. (5.56, 20mm OCIW, 25mm OCSW...)

Some of the posters don't seem convinced about the utility of electronic fuses etc. on a small calibre grenade. This is the same technology you rely on for a lot of other things, like artillery shells and anti-tank missiles, just in a new package. A mechanical fuse "might" work, but the effect would be about the same as comparing an 8 track to an iPod. What would you rather have?

Just a bit off topic, but perhaps there should be reserch alternative area supression technology. The Australian Metalstorm company has developed an electronic "gun" which has almost no moving parts, and can fire rounds at almost any cyclic rate the shooter desires. Some prototypes have demonstrated a firing rate of 1,000,000 RPM (not a typo). See: http://www.metalstorm.com/ for more info
 
~RoKo~ said:
The Russians also produce something similar, the AGS-17. It's 30mm, however.

http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/LAND-FORCES/Army/AGS-17.html
http://naoruzanje.paracin.co.yu/ags-17.html

Recently I saw one of these here in Sydney. It which was captured in Iraq by our SF. All steel stamped, but it did the job.

Cheers,

Wes
 
I think I would have a hard time trying to get a licence for an automatic 40 mm grenade launcher...

There is no license for grenade launchers, automatic or otherwise.  They can be bought by any person.  A grenade launcher doesn't fire the round at a high enough velocity to legally qualify as a "firearm" in Canada.  Lots of private citizens buy them to mount under thier M4 barrels to launch "flares".

The nifty ammunition, on the other hand...
 
actually they've been around since the 1970's (mk19)
and before that a different small one that used standard M79 / M-203 40mm (lower pressure - shorter range then the mk19 ammo) ammo and was fired by turning a crank I forget the designation it held.
 
SteelMag said:
So what happens when that box of 40mm grenades gets nailed with some bullets?..

can anyone say KA-BOOM.

40mm Grenades have centrifically armed impact fuses. So in order for them to High Order they need to turn "X" number of revolutions in flight for the fuse train to become armed. This makes them quite safe when being handled and is also a safe guard against someone accidentally popping off an M203 inside an AFV or being fragged from hitting a target which is much too close. The actual distance of flight and revolutions required to arm it escapes me.

As a side note, 40mm duds are some of the most sensitive UXO's found on the battlefield. Some of you may remember the Reservist who accidentally kicked one while setting out a defensive position up here in Pet. IIRC he was helivac'd to Ottawa because of his injuries. 

Scotty
 
While M203's are not a firearm in Canada (I have a personal one) the Mk19 and HK GMG have a high velocity 40mm that actually is above the velocity threshold for a firearms and are prohibited devices for they are also automatic...


Pappy: IIRC it was the MK37


 
computer chips in ICBM's, some of the most carefully maintained weapons on the planet, nestled in perfect cocoons conducive to their protection, or computer chips in something that is going to mass produced at astonishing rates and then treated with equal disdain later and subjected to battlefield conditions... not to mention EMP's, how would you like it if all your grenades were useless because a hydro transformer blew up nearby... the simpler it is the better. unless we absolutely need computerized grenades then lets avoid the hassle.
 
clarification, the grenades are great, this AGL is great too, just not the chips...

I prefer salsa ;)
 
???

Chips?


The fuze is centrifugal - same as arty rounds...

Where is the computer in that?
 
I think what is being referred to here is the computerized fuze's for the 20mm OCIW and 25mm OCSW programs. The laser rangefinder built into the weapons system transfers range data to the grenade fuse, allowing it to burst at the correct distance (i.e. right over the poor bastard's head).

Conceptually, you could do this with some sort of mechanical fuse, but the fuse would take up a lot of room inside a very small shell, and not be very flexible, perhaps only able to detonate at pre-programmed 20m increments, rather than right at the target (1 Grenadier, Range 112.36m...). Computer chips are now quite rugged, cheap and can be hardened against EMP through the simple expedient of surrounding the electronics case in aluminum foil, although more elaborate shielding will probably be used.

Electronic sights and fuses are the future, so we need to think about how we can use the flexibility they offer.
 
armybuck041 said:
40mm Grenades have centrifically armed impact fuses. So in order for them to High Order they need to turn "X" number of revolutions in flight for the fuse train to become armed. This makes them quite safe when being handled and is also a safe guard against someone accidentally popping off an M203 inside an AFV or being fragged from hitting a target which is much too close. The actual distance of flight and revolutions required to arm it escapes me.

The grenade must travel 14-28 metres before it arms according to the US Marine Corps.
 
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