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Fmr MCpl Patrik Mathews - facing U.S. federal charges/alleged white supremacist

mariomike

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Saw this in today's Winnipeg Free Press,

Winnipeg Free Press
08/16/2019

https://www.winnipegfreepress.com/local/homegrown-hate-547510902.html
A military spokesman told the Free Press he could not comment on specific investigations into members, but that "in any instance where information indicates discriminatory behaviour by a CAF member action is taken."

- mod edit to flesh out current situation -
 

brihard

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mariomike said:
Saw this in today's Winnipeg Free Press,

Mm hm. And it’s probably gonna get quite a bit worse before it gets better.
 

Jarnhamar

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Seems to me the CAF is being used to push a political narrative right in time for election.


 

Fishbone Jones

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https://www.winnipegfreepress.com/local/white-supremacist-in-army-reserve-553050082.html?fbclid=IwAR0gdWGEReORa3Q98xqqlnnCQcknZ-hls031AtgZzJvNkKu9YkxSQdcBzl0#&gid=null&pid=2

The man who is recruiting in Winnipeg for a neo-Nazi paramilitary group holds a leadership position in the Canadian Army Reserve and is a trained explosives expert.

The Free Press has identified Master Cpl. Patrik Mathews, 26, as the man responsible for the neo-Nazi propaganda posters that have been posted throughout the city in recent weeks.

The posters were part of a recruitment drive for The Base, a white supremacist network that’s active on three continents. Experts on hate groups say The Base represents the most radical, violent fringes of the extremist right.

Mathews is a trained combat engineer, which makes him an explosives expert, and is an active member of the army reserve. Combat engineers are responsible for conducting a number of construction and demolition tasks under battle conditions.

As a master corporal, he is considered to be in a leadership position and oversees and instructs privates who work under him.

The Free Press asked the Canadian Armed Forces to confirm if Mathews is a member at 12:30 p.m. Saturday. By 2:30 p.m. Sunday, a spokeswoman said she was unable to confirm if there was a member under that name since it was the weekend and access to personnel files was limited.

More at link
 

PMedMoe

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If verified, dishonourable discharge.  We don't need that shit in the CF.
 

brihard

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PMedMoe said:
If verified, dishonourable discharge.  We don't need that crap in the CF.

They can only do that if they can hit him with a service offense. As a reservist that's gonna be tough- they'd need to prove him having committed an offense while subject to the Code of Service Discipline... Probably we'll see an administrative review followed by a release under 5f, unsuitable for further service for reasons within his control.

That said- do the due diligence, and if this is in fact the individual in question, get rid of him post haste and publicly. This kind of conduct is a disgrace.

I have no doubt that we have some such individuals in our ranks. I strongly suspect at least some will be known to various police and security agencies. It is very much in the interests of the institution and in the national interest to root them out and to excise them from the military as completely as can be achieved, obviously subject to discretion where there may be ongoing investigative or intelligence interests.
 

Jarnhamar

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Not to take away from him being a shit head if this is true but would a reservist MCpl engineer be considered an explosives "expert"?

 

brihard

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Jarnhamar said:
Not to take away from him being a crap head if this is true but would a reservist MCpl engineer be considered an explosives "expert"?

Probably moreso than your average nut who downloaded a copy of the Anarchist's Cookbook. 'Expert' as most of us would see the term? No, likely not... Some loose reporting on this, the author would have benefitted from maybe working his contacts for another day to feel out what the army reserve is about. But he's not totally out to lunch either. I'm sure a combat engineer MCpl knows enough about explosives to make better use of them than most, and to be a real problem were he inclined to be, and if he had access to explosive material. It also gives him a much stronger foundation to 'self teach' beyond his formal qualifications.
 

brihard

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For reference, this builds off the author's in depth investigation (and to an extent infiltration) of Canada's white supremacist movement, as recounted in the same paper days ago. He had mentioned he was 'on' to someone in the military and was working on an ID.

Original link shared in another thread by (of course ;)) Mariomike in our 'Religious/Extremist Terrorism: Non-Muslim Edition' thread. https://army.ca/forums/threads/124385/post-1580525.html#msg1580525
 

Jarnhamar

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Brihard said:
Probably moreso than your average nut who downloaded a copy of the Anarchist's Cookbook. 'Expert' as most of us would see the term? No, likely not...

Good point.

What gets me is that some of this guys peers had to know what his activities were and the circles he hung around in but never reported it sooner. Comments in the mess, posts on social media. I'm guessing it's not going to be a surprise to people that know him. Hopefully the police start asking people some uncomfortable questions.


This is another example of why I think bystander training (and awareness) where there's human to human discussions are more important to the CAF than our mandated online GBA+ culture.

 

brihard

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Jarnhamar said:
Good point.

What gets me is that some of this guys peers had to know what his activities were and the circles he hung around in but never reported it sooner. Comments in the mess, posts on social media. I'm guessing it's not going to be a surprise to people that know him. Hopefully the police start asking people some uncomfortable questions.


This is another example of why I think bystander training (and awareness) where there's human to human discussions are more important to the CAF than our mandated online GBA+ culture.

Mm hm. I got a decent 'insider threat' training session a year or two back, it was a couple hours well spent. The CAF could use some of that, properly delivered by people who can tailor it appropriately to a given audience. It's just like we were told overseas , 'every soldier is a sensor' in the context of gathering intelligence. We absolutely have people within the ranks who pose a security threat to Canada, and who will be most easily 'outed' by a combination of someone in their peer group noticing something, and then passing it up appropriately, allowing for the right person to ask the right questions.

And, all that said, I have absolutely no idea what the MP group has in terms of internal security intelligence gathering- nor is it my business to. I would hope that they're already quite active in that, and I trust that if not, they soon will be.
 

Journeyman

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Brihard said:
It also gives him a much stronger foundation to 'self teach' beyond his formal qualifications.
Very good point. 

In addition to learning via Google, he's well situated to learn more within the Engineer community -- where he may come across as technically/professionally enthusiastic,  as well as within the White Supremacist community -- where he may be seen as a key individual to nurture/exploit. 

Not that I would remotely consider him any sort of explosives super soldier, but neither do I discount the public relations  ":panic: factor."

 

brihard

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Journeyman said:
Very good point. 

In addition to learning via Google, he's well situated to learn more within the Engineer community -- where he may come across as technically/professionally enthusiastic,  as well as within the White Supremacist community -- where he may be seen as a key individual to nurture/exploit. 

Not that I would remotely consider him any sort of explosives super soldier, but neither do I discount the public relations  ":panic: factor."

You're better qualified to speak to it than I, but I would also be concerned about the potentially imminent forced exit from the military as being a potential catalyst towards further radicalization / action. Staying in has presented some opportunities that are best preserved while 'laying low'. Being outed and removed potentially changes some calculus there.
 

AbdullahD

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I tried to do some digging on this subject.. may have failed miserably as some things still elude me.

This chap, has allegedly shown signs that are extremely troubling and called for violence and should be dealt with immediately if found to be true.

I just need to clarify something for myself, the real reason he is in trouble and/or being "outed" is his calls for violence, Not his belief in white supremacy? If so that is completely ok with me and understandable. Where it gets trickier if he simply believes in the Neo-Nazi ideologies and/or white supremacy, why or how can he be punished for what he personally believes?

Yes, I think they are disgusting beliefs. Yes, I only think fools really believe it. Yes, I think it needs to be removed from society and made a footnote in history.. I am just considering the implications. Leave it alone they can actively recruit.. true. But if we go after this ideology and punish those who adhere, it gives them far more ammunition or even a catalyst.

I just wanted to be clear the major issue is his calls for violence or have someone explain to me the how or why we have to censor his beliefs however disgusting I/we find them.. maybe I have it all mixxed up in my head. Or is there a professional standard in tue CAF that members can not have these beliefs? Reading the earlier posts it looks like that is not the case. Or heck maybe I am just tired of the immediate response of banning or censoring everything we do not like.. albeit this case could be warranted.

I'm done my rambling, thanks for reading.
Abdullah
 

Journeyman

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Brihard said:
... I would also be concerned about the potentially imminent forced exit from the military as being a potential catalyst towards further radicalization.
Absolutely.  A recurring theme is 'otherness' -- being an 'outsider.'  He had a peer group, that on various levels (including likely some degree of alt-right concurrence) provided support and/or a suitable echo chamber;  now he's being "punished," "oppressed," what have you, by what he'll no doubt see as a bleeding-heart. immigrant-loving government, destroying the country.... or some equally nonsensical drivel (it's not unheard of on this site  :not-again: ).

I have doubts that the CAF is considering more than merely punting the soldier (providing the government an election-year soundbite of being tough on violent extremism), without consideration of any knock-on effects... which could potentially be mitigated by hooking the troop with some form of deradicalization program.
 

Cloud Cover

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Sorry, but they look just like a group of caliphate crapheads (with their black face coverings) in need of a really bad day. The scary thing is that when they come out of prison, they will be worse than when they went in, and that's a scary thought.
 

Retired AF Guy

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Brihard said:
And, all that said, I have absolutely no idea what the MP group has in terms of internal security intelligence gathering- nor is it my business to. I would hope that they're already quite active in that, and I trust that if not, they soon will be.

I believe its the NCIU that would look after this kind of stuff.
 

brihard

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AbdullahD said:
I tried to do some digging on this subject.. may have failed miserably as some things still elude me.

This chap, has allegedly shown signs that are extremely troubling and called for violence and should be dealt with immediately if found to be true.

I just need to clarify something for myself, the real reason he is in trouble and/or being "outed" is his calls for violence, Not his belief in white supremacy? If so that is completely ok with me and understandable. Where it gets trickier if he simply believes in the Neo-Nazi ideologies and/or white supremacy, why or how can he be punished for what he personally believes?

Yes, I think they are disgusting beliefs. Yes, I only think fools really believe it. Yes, I think it needs to be removed from society and made a footnote in history.. I am just considering the implications. Leave it alone they can actively recruit.. true. But if we go after this ideology and punish those who adhere, it gives them far more ammunition or even a catalyst.

I just wanted to be clear the major issue is his calls for violence or have someone explain to me the how or why we have to censor his beliefs however disgusting I/we find them.. maybe I have it all mixxed up in my head. Or is there a professional standard in tue CAF that members can not have these beliefs? Reading the earlier posts it looks like that is not the case. Or heck maybe I am just tired of the immediate response of banning or censoring everything we do not like.. albeit this case could be warranted.

I'm done my rambling, thanks for reading.
Abdullah

Let's say that independently of violence, recruitment, propaganda, or incitement, that a CAF member is found to have such views- a decent precedent would be the navy members who showed up in 'proud boys' garb in Halifax last year. They all were put on 'counseling and probation', basically the last step of administrative action before someone is released. That's for views and actions that fall still somewhat shy of outright white supremacy.

Make no bones about it: Holding supremacist/racist views of any sort is incompatible with honourable service to Canada. It reflects poorly on the military as an institution, and it compromises someone's ability to be trusted with information when they hold views that are at odds with our national interest and with the institutional ethos. Anyone so found will, best case to them, be given one and only one chance. As has been well said by others, "I cannot change your views, but I can change your employment".

I would say that anyone who even views violence in the pursuit of these beliefs as acceptable is someone who needs to be swiftly out of the military. This stuff verges on the national security world at this point.
 
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