F15X

[tomahawk6]

Less expensive to operate and cheaper than an F35 , and its got dual engines.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/companies/lockheed-f-35-dinged-as-boeings-f-15x-wins-in-air-forces-plan/ar-BBUVShv?ocid=spartanntp

 

[tomahawk6]

Dump the F35 and get F15x's.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/why-f-15x-could-poor-050000308.html

 

[MilEME09]

https://nationalinterest.org/blog/buzz/f-15s-steroids-why-f-15x-should-make-f-35-fans-pretty-nervous-49982

Task and purpose is pushing the F-15X pretty hard, even calling it the poor mans F35

 

[Good2Golf]

As people come to appreciate that the F-35’s principle strength is its connectivity to, and feeding of, the 5th Gen digital battlesphere, (with stealth being more of a supporting characteristic to its presence in the digital battlesphere than the prime discriminator), the more they will come to realize the depth of capability that will come with more platforms joining that digitally-focused battlespace.  F-15X, F-21, etc., leveraging many of the elements of the connectivity spectrum initially spearheaded by the F-22 (and arguably F-117), and followed by the F-35, and adding UCAVs like X-47B into the mix, can only reinforce the strengths of such intergration of sensors and effectors.  I can’t help but still see the value of a digitally-enhanced F-15X in the future...

:2c:

Regards
G2G

 

[MarkOttawa]

GoodtoGolf: Serious question: how relevant are all those capabilities of the F-35 to the NORAD mission, the only one that is fundamental for Canada and hence the RCAF (defence against help, from USAF based in Canada)? As far as one can see the USAF has no plans to use F-35s in Alaska for NORAD for at least a fair while to come. So no interoperability or use of those capabilities.

Another honest question: for NORAD interception, of both bombers and cruise missiles, would not the F-15X with its very big missile load, higher speed and longer range (and now competitive cost) be a better fit for the RCAF in that context, for the future one can reasonably foresee?

Mark
Ottawa

 

[Colin Parkinson]

As much as norad is the "primary mission", just how many sorties have we done in the last 10 years compared to sorties overseas by all types of RCAF aircraft, excluding SAR and transport?

 

[MarkOttawa]

Colin P.: Those missions were entirely optional. Missions of choice. Defence of Canada (and the US) is not. Unless we surrender our self-defence.

Mark
Ottawa

 

[Good2Golf]

GoodtoGolf: Serious question: how relevant are all those capabilities of the F-35 to the NORAD mission, the only one that is fundamental for Canada and hence the RCAF (defence against help, from USAF based in Canada)? As far as one can see the USAF has no plans to use F-35s in Alaska for NORAD for at least a fair while to come. So no interoperability or use of those capabilities.

Another honest question: for NORAD interception, of both bombers and cruise missiles, would not the F-15X with its very big missile load, higher speed and longer range (and now competitive cost) be a better fit for the RCAF in that context, for the future one can reasonably foresee?

Mark
Ottawa

Mark, with the caveat that I never did any ‘hard time’ in NORAD, just a couple of staff visits to Cheyenne Mountain and Peterson AFB, I would say anything that supports interoperability with the USAF/NORAD/NORTHCOM can’t be a bad thing, and particularly if it can support working with the F-22s (and legacy 15Cs) currently supporting ANR (Alaska NORAD Region) and CANR (Canada NORAD Region) coordination. The 5th Gen digital battlespace exists globally, so being able to work within, whether as part of supporting NORAD specifically, or coalition ops elsewhere, would be beneficial to the RCAF’s capacity.

I don’t know enough about value of particular weapons’ loadout for the NORAD mission, nor to be honest should it really be an in-depth/detailed discussion point even if I did, so I’ll “take an ‘e-knee” on answering your follow-on question.

Regards
G2G

 

[Colin Parkinson]

Colin P.: Those missions were entirely optional. Missions of choice. Defence of Canada (and the US) is not. Unless we surrender our self-defence.

Mark
Ottawa

We have given up most of our self-defense options already. We will continue to be expeditionary military for quite sometime, in fact I will argue that taking part in the overseas stuff is not truly optional, precisely because we cannot defend ourselves and therefore must be a contributing member of the pack.

 

[a_majoor]

The F-15X gives us the "best of both worlds" if we so choose. The basic airframe is well proven and has long legs, ideal for northern patrols, and especially when filled with lots of long range missiles.

The long range and heavy carrying capacity also provides the means to do things like patrolling the oceans while carrying anti ship missiles, or going into expeditionary roles with a versatile long range strike aircraft. Even if coalition F-35s are leading the way and designating targets, having a large "bomb truck" or "arsenal aircraft" which happens to be a full up fighter is always something that can be taken to the table. I would fully support a 100 strong fleet of F-15X's if the government cannot or will not purchase F-35s.

 

[PuckChaser]

We're not going to get them though. Boeing is bidding the Super Hornet. If we dont get the F35, itll be a Gripen, SH, Typhoon or nothing.

 

[YZT580]

We're not going to get them though. Boeing is bidding the Super Hornet. If we dont get the F35, itll be a Gripen, SH, Typhoon or nothing.

NOT NECESSARILY.  COMPETITION CLOSES AT END OF YEAR.  ELECTION IS IN OCTOBER.  IT JUST MIGHT BE SCHEER WHO GETS TO MUCK IT UP AGAIN

 

[PuckChaser]

We cant force a company to bid a certain aircraft unless the SH gets excluded for technical reasons.

 

[MilEME09]

We cant force a company to bid a certain aircraft unless the SH gets excluded for technical reasons.

They could make a range/endurance requirement to favour the f15X

 

[Colin Parkinson]

We're not going to get them though. Boeing is bidding the Super Hornet. If we dont get the F35, itll be a Gripen, SH, Typhoon or nothing.

As mentioned they are presenting the aircraft they think matches the possible specs and purse of Canada. If we changed the spec and how we talked about our willingness to pay, then they offer the F15x.

 

[SupersonicMax]

I’d be extremely surprised to see Boeing bid the F-15X. They have no need to keep that line opened (they have the Saudis buying a variant of the X, the F-15SA) and have interest in keeping the Super Hornet line opened long enough to market their Advanced Super Hornet.

 

[PuckChaser]

They could make a range/endurance requirement to favour the f15X

And then get sued by Lockheed, Eurofighter and Saab.

You guys are forgetting we don't get the aircraft we want with our procurement system, we get the aircraft that TB and PSPC say we can have. They'll make us change required specs to optional ones to include more bidders, and at the end of the day we don't even get the best aircraft out of the bids. We get the one that has the most Canadian pork-barreling.

I really like the F-15X as an option if we're not getting F35s. Its certainly better than SH, Gripen and Eurofighter. I just really doubt we'll be able to affect the process enough to get what we want.

 

[tomahawk6]

The ability of the aircraft to carry 22 air to air missiles I think is a game changer for the air superiority mission. The aircraft would have Boeings Amber missile racks.

 

[YZT580]

3 to 1.  That is 3 F15X led by one F35 with the F35 never firing a shot. That would give 66 war shots controlled from a position completely removed from the source of the shots. Has there ever been a squadron composed of different aircraft trained to work together?  Disadvantages: two training streams, parts requirements and maintenance training so there would be no savings and deployment logistics would be far more complicated.  Advantages: wouldn't need to launch the F35 for many intercepts or routine patrols and they have a higher per hour cost, more flexible fleet, longer duration on station, higher attack speeds mach 2 vs. 1.6. 

 

[suffolkowner]

f35 vs f15 graphic