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Ex-serviceman risks eviction by flying Canadian flag on balcony

More flag "flap". 

Flag flap leads to war of words
Article link

OTTAWA -- The Great Ottawa Flag War is raging.

On one side, Gaetane True, property manager of Montfort Manor Apartments on Langs Rd. in the east end, and Zev Shafran, president of Devonshire Properties Inc. that owns the 170-unit building of mostly seniors.

On the other side, tenants in six of the units, led by Canadian military vets R. Guy “Vache” Vachon, 75, and Fred Norman, 69, who are furiously defying the edict posted on the lobby wall July 21 that read “those who have any type of flags on their balconies or on their windows, we ask to please take them down.”

Battle cry of Gaetane True, 11 years running the building: “If they want to fly their flags inside their apartments with a fan making them flutter so they can show them off to their friends, fine. But just don’t let me have to look at them.”

Battle cry of Vache Vachon, 25 years in the army, including combat in the Korean War: “I’m not moving my flags from the balcony. I’ll stay with them until I croak.”

Battle cry of Zev Shafran in Vancouver: “We are asking for the building to be brought into a more sightly scene.” 

Battle cry of Fred Norman, fightin’ Cape Bretoner: “I served my country for 23 years under the flag of Canada, I’ll be damned if I’ll remove it. If I have to go down with my flag, I will.”

Mostly the Canadian flag. Mostly small flags on little poles attached to the balcony railings. Or in the case of Vache Vachon, the Canadian flag, Acadian flag in honour of his roots, and a Support Our Troops in Afghanistan flag.

In June, Shafran decided the balcony flags were an eye-sore and told True to post the lobby memo.

More on link
 
Not really an update to the story, but kinda fits the topic.

http://www.sunnewsnetwork.ca/sunnews/canada/archives/2011/09/20110927-211338.html

OTTAWA -- Flying the Canadian flag is sacrosanct. At least it will be if a new law is passed.
The Conservatives will unfurl a private member's bill on Parliament Hill Wednesday that would make it illegal to prevent anyone from displaying the maple leaf in a proper manner.

"The Canadian flag represents the principles of freedom, democracy, courage and justice," reads a portion of the proposed law. "The Canadian flag represents the pride in our great nation and support for those who have sacrificed their lives for it."
 
Beat me to it - here's what was said in the House of Commons on this yesterday when the bill was introduced and passed first reading:
Mr. John Carmichael (Don Valley West, CPC) moved for leave to introduce Bill C-288, An Act respecting the National Flag of Canada.

He said: Mr. Speaker, I rise today to proudly introduce my bill entitled, “National Flag of Canada Act”. The purpose of this enactment is to ensure that all Canadians from coast to coast to coast have the right to fly the national flag of Canada.

It is in the national and public interest that all Canadians have the right and privilege to display the national flag of Canada and that no Canadian shall be restricted from displaying our flag. The Canadian flag represents all Canadian citizens. It represents pride in our great nation and support for those who have sacrificed their lives for the principles that it embodies: freedom, democracy, courage, and justice, upon which our great nation was built.
Hansard, 27 Sept 11

And here's a link to more information about the proposed act - proposed text attached.

Caveat:  most private members bills do NOT become law.
 
What they need to be doing is making sure that people respect the flag by replacing it when it becomes tattered, faded or otherwise worn. I don't have enough time in the day to stop at every business I see flying a shoddy example of our national flag and ask them to replace it.
 
recceguy said:
What they need to be doing is making sure that people respect the flag by replacing it when it becomes tattered, faded or otherwise worn. I don't have enough time in the day to stop at every business I see flying a shoddy example of our national flag and ask them to replace it.

I have an elderly (80 +) Aunt who does ( have both the time and intent). It is quite entertaining to watch her tear into some poor maintenance type or official at a civic building or school.  ;D
 
recceguy said:
What they need to be doing is making sure that people respect the flag by replacing it when it becomes tattered, faded or otherwise worn. I don't have enough time in the day to stop at every business I see flying a shoddy example of our national flag and ask them to replace it.
One could argue such flags are very loved, like my favorite pair of pants.  A little tlc and they'll look as good as new.
 
milnews.ca said:
Beat me to it - here's what was said in the House of Commons on this yesterday when the bill was introduced and passed first reading:Hansard, 27 Sept 11

And here's a link to more information about the proposed act - proposed text attached.

Caveat:  most private members bills do NOT become law.

More government meddling into my private property. Just what this country needs...........
 
recceguy said:
What they need to be doing is making sure that people respect the flag by replacing it when it becomes tattered, faded or otherwise worn. I don't have enough time in the day to stop at every business I see flying a shoddy example of our national flag and ask them to replace it.

Amen to that!  I don't know how many times my OSI has been triggered by that brother!

On a lighter note, though, there is a cookie cutter box mall near my home in Scarborough (Surprise  ::) ) is right next to the 401/Highway of heroes.  They fly this enormous Canadian flag, and without fail always have it down as soon as word of a fallen comes back home.  One day last fall, we had a huge thunderstorm, which tore the bottom half ( saw this in the evening as I was picking up my usual order at the LCBO right across from the flag pole  :blotto:).  The next morning, typical Sunny day ready to dry the wetness, I drive by and there is a brand new flag waving!  I had to stop, and get out of the car to make sure my eyers were not playing tricks.

First of all, I was surprised to see this where I live.  Second, with the storm a brewing I did not expect anyone to care about the state of the flag, and third due to the size of this flag I say it would have cost a pretty penny to have one, let alone a spare.  But sure as I write this, they replaced the damaged one before the next day!

Makes me proud to be Canadian.  We don't need to promote our devotion to the flag, we just do it.

Picture of Flagpole from Google

dileas

tess


 
I can tell you from experience (grew up in Pickering, worked overnight security at that mall) that, this particular mall has three of those flags ready to go. In fact, I have seen these flags presented to the families of the fallen from the area.  :salute: All around. Truly an example.
 
psionic0 said:
I can tell you from experience (grew up in Pickering, worked overnight security at that mall) that, this particular mall has three of those flags ready to go. In fact, I have seen these flags presented to the families of the fallen from the area.  :salute: All around. Truly an example.

To hear that, just reaffirms my respect to them.  :salute:

dileas

tess
 
Go figure - the NDP opposing a bill, even a Private Members Bill that has little chance of passing.  Who'd've thunk it?
A Conservative bill that would make it a crime to prevent someone from flying the Canadian flag is an unnecessary distraction when Parliament has real work to do, a New Democrat critic said Wednesday.

NDP MP Charlie Angus said the private member's bill, introduced by rookie backbencher John Carmichael, is akin to "tabloid-style politics" at a time of a looming economic crisis.

"I never knew, until John told me 30 seconds ago, that we had a flag crisis of people being intimidated and not being allowed to use the flag," Angus said on CTV's Power Play.

Angus, who is the NDP's ethics critic, also pondered why the government would support a new flag bill when it continues to buy Maple Leaf pins from China.

"People come to my office and see a flag that says ‘Made in China,' so I've actually stopped giving out the Canadian flag pins, because my constituents say they don't want to see something made in China," Angus said.

"Why is this government shipping out our jobs overseas?" ....
CTV.ca, 28 Sept 11
 
milnews.ca said:
Go figure - the NDP opposing a bill, even a Private Members Bill that has little chance of passing.  Who'd've thunk it?[/size]

One expects a certain amount of that from the Opposition.
 
Is the landlord/tenant not Canadian?  Cuz I can't say that I've known a Canadian who would ever tell someone they can't display a Canadian flag here...

-T.
 
I heard on the news many condo/private apartment complexes have strict rules about flags etc.

They need to shake their f*ckiing heads.....what gave them the right to tell anyone about what flag to fly?......
 
FlyingDutchman said:
One could argue such flags are very loved, like my favorite pair of pants.  A little tlc and they'll look as good as new.

Not when they are tattered back past the maple leaf.
 
More, albeit a nonsensical more, on this, from a columnist whose views I normally respect, reproduced under the Fair Dealing provisions of the Copyright Act from the Globe and Mail:

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/politics/lysiane-gagnon/the-pms-overzealous-glorification-of-the-flag-is-a-joke/article2187025/
The PM's overzealous glorification of the flag is a joke

LYSIANE GAGNON
From Monday's Globe and Mail

Published Monday, Oct. 03, 2011

Two years in jail for preventing someone from displaying a Canadian flag? This is too silly for words. “A wacky solution to a non-existent problem,” wrote La Presse columnist Yves Boisvert.

As if there weren’t more pressing issues to deal with, the Harper government is going to war against apartment buildings that forbid residents from flying small Canadian flags on their windows or balconies. I live in a condo where we’re not allowed to encumber our windows with posters, commercial signs, banners or flags of any kind, whether it’s a Maple Leaf, a fleur-de-lys or the emblem of Saudi Arabia. If this bill is passed, the amiable manager and elected administrators of my building would be liable to a fine or even risk a jail sentence.

Forget the earnest English-Canadian tourists who affix Maple Leaves to their backpack to avoid being taken for Americans. Showing off your country’s flag when you’re safely at home has a political meaning. It is often a sign of intense nationalism, which usually appeals to extreme-right parties in most developed countries (an exception is the United States, where many homeowners flaunt the Stars and Stripes on their lawn). Even in France, where the famous tricolore is cherished, the national flag is not displayed on private residences, even on July 14, the national holiday.

In Quebec, it is quite unusual to see flags exhibited on a balcony or a lawn outside election or referendum campaigns, and then they are political statements: a fleur-de-lys means that the resident is a sovereigntist; a Maple Leaf means he’s a die-hard federalist. But most people, especially in the cities, are discreet about their political allegiances.

The monarchist bent of the Harper government is even more intolerable than its overzealous veneration of the national flag. From now on, all Canadian embassies will be forced to welcome the visitors with a huge portrait of the Queen – a misrepresentation of modern Canada, where the British monarchy is nothing but a mere symbol.

Worse, two brightly coloured landscapes of Alfred Pellan, one of Quebec’s foremost 20th-century artists (ironically, he was a committed federalist), were removed from the Foreign Affairs headquarters in Ottawa and replaced by a picture of the Queen.

One painting was called Canada West and the other Canada East. Weren’t they a more appropriate representation of Canada than the stuffy old British lady? Isn’t it enough that the Queen appears on each of our $20 bills?

Seen from Quebec, the “royalization” of Canada so actively pursued by the Harper government looks like something from Mars. According to Le Devoir, the British crown might eventually be inscribed in the inside pages of our future electronic passports. Foreign Affairs and Passport Canada officials have refused to confirm the information but if this happens, it would be an intolerable insult to all citizens who are not of British origin (and they now form the majority in Canada).

Has the Harper government decided to make francophone citizens feel like strangers in their own country? French Canadians are not actively hostile to the Crown. They are indifferent. Rare are those who call for an alternative formula for choosing a head of state, for the simple reason that people have more important problems to deal with and that the transition to another system would be even more divisive than the painful constitutional squabbles of the 1980s and 1990s. But what French Canadians don’t want is to see more symbols of a history they don’t share forced on them.

First: allow me to repeat "I am not a fervent monarchist but I feel that so long as we are a monarchy we should not be ashamed to show our royal symbols. If we want republican symbols then let's become a republic ..."

Second: this is part of the process I mention regularly - it is necessary to "govern without Québec ~ not against Québec, just without either pandering to it or depending upon it for electoral success." This policy will be problematical in Québec but it is a "winner" almost everywhere else sp no one, at least no one who matters, gives a damn about Québec's republican anti-English sensitivities.
 
E.R. Campbell said:
More, albeit a nonsensical more, on this, from a columnist whose views I normally respect, reproduced under the Fair Dealing provisions of the Copyright Act from the Globe and Mail:

In Quebec, it is quite unusual to see flags exhibited on a balcony or a lawn outside election or referendum campaigns, and then they are political statements: a fleur-de-lys means that the resident is a sovereigntist; a Maple Leaf means he’s a die-hard federalist. But most people, especially in the cities, are discreet about their political allegiances.


Makes me wonder if this journalist has ever been to Quebec.  I have seen the Fleur-de-lys flown on all sorts of private residences in Quebec.  Quite a multitude, in fact.  Some in CFB Gagetown may even remember seeing members of 5 eme Bde show up wearing it on their uniforms in the past. 
 
George Wallace said:
I have seen the Fleur-de-lys flown on all sorts of private residences in Quebec.  Quite a multitude, in fact.

Actually, it depends on the time of the year; in june/july, it is common. The rest of the year, not as much.

There is a perception, for some people here, that flying a flag represents a political statement: if you fly the Québec flag, you are a separatist; if you fly the Canadian flag, you are a federalist.
 
Jungle said:
Actually, it depends on the time of the year; in june/july, it is common. The rest of the year, not as much.

There is a perception, for some people here, that flying a flag represents a political statement: if you fly the Québec flag, you are a separatist; if you fly the Canadian flag, you are a federalist.

I fly it because I'm a Canadian.
 
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