Direct entry program?

[tomahawk6]

This subject is well worth discussing IMO. Perhaps merging this with one of the year old topics ?

Direct entry for special operations units is a way to broaden the pool of potential recruits. US Army Special Forces cannot fill all the ODA's we have on the books. The Ranger battalions are fully manned but the burn out rate is high. Typically SF tries to recruit from airborne and ranger units. No one stays more than 3 years in a Ranger battalion before going back to an infantry assignment, unless they try to go SF.

Even the Aussies have gone the direct recruitment route to fill vacancies.

http://www.defence.gov.au/news/armynews/editions/1085/topstories/story01.htm

 

[HItorMiss]

British TA SAS also recruit off the street, so here lies a serious question....

Why has Canada not thought about this route, not for say JTF-2 But perhaps CSOR.

Then again there is a lot to be said about an already well trained soldier with a grasp of military life and discipline.

*EDIT: for clarity

 

[Good2Golf]

Okay, this is where the issue currently is:

http://www.cansofcom.forces.gc.ca/en/recruiting_e.asp

Is there potential to recruit to certain selected occupations/trades within such organizations?  Probably, but nothing formally on the books at this time. 

Were you thinking "can someone recruit directly into an operator stream?"  I'm not sure that the CF is there yet...but I might be wrong.

G2G

 

[big bad john]

The Royal Marines would be a good comparison of a Direct Entry to a SOF program that is successful.  But be reminded that the "Basic Training" plan is 32 weeks long.

Phase 1

Module 1 - Foundation
"To effect the transition from civilian to military life and prepare the individual recruit for training in the Royal Marines"


Week 1 - Joining routine, MSC (military skills & circuits) assessment, kit issue, NAMET exams, admin, drill & PT
Week 2 - Ex First Step (1 night in the field - Woodbury Common), drill, PT & personal admin
Week 3 - Weapon training, drill, PT & Families Day
LWEL (long weekend leave)


Module 2 - Individual Skills
"To teach and practise elementary military skills in a progressive manner"

Week 4 - Weapon training, PT and swims, drill & Corps history, Ex Early Knight (night in field with weapon - behind Tarzan Course)
Week 5 - Weapon training (including weapon handling tests), PT & runs, map reading, Ex Quick Cover (3 day field exercise including basic fieldcraft and CQB - Woodbury Common)
Week 6 - First aid, rifle shoot, PT, map reading
Week 7 - Ex Marshal Star (3 1/2 day field ex including basic fieldcraft & soldiering skills - Woodbury Common)
Week 8 - Drill, PT, map reading, first aid, survival training (Stallcombe)
Week 9 - Drill, PT (Gym Passout), map reading, first aid (including NVQ testing), LSW conversion
Week 10 - Ex Hunter's Moon (5 day field ex including navigation training and map reading including 24-hour survival training - Dartmoor, Gidleigh)
LWEL


Module 3 - Advanced Skills
"To consolidate the skills learned thus far and progress onto more advanced aspects of individual soldiering"

Week 11 - Live firing: rifle to APWT (Combat Infantryman)(Straightpoint Range)
Week 12 - APWT (Combat Infantryman), rifle transition to live firing & LSW APWA (Willsworthy Range on Dartmoor)
Week 13 - NBC, signals, grenade throwing & helicopter dunker drills
Week 14 - First fit of Lovats & Blues, NBC, signals, Ex Running Man (3 day field ex, mainly navigation training & yomping, Woodbury Common)
Week 15 - Individual skills revision, Ex Baptist Run (2 day field test ex to test all skills taught in Phase 1 - includes stalking, kit inspections, map reading, NBC, signals, deservicing inspection - Woodbury Common), first drill inspection, arms drill passout, End of Phase 1 Parade
LWEL


Phase 2

Module 4 - Operations of War
"To train and practice a recruit in the tactical skills and knowledge required to act as a rifleman in all operations of war and all transitional phases of war"

Week 16 - Signals, Battle Physical Training (BPT), 51 mm mortar training
Week 17 - Ex First Base (tactical field patrols [recce & OPs] & harbour drills - Perridge Estate)
Week 18 - Ex Second Empire (section & tp level attacks, tp fighting patrols & ambushes - Woodbury Common)
Week 19 - Underslung-Grenade Launcher (UGL) training, 94 mm LAW training (currently GPMG training), R & I/Adventure Training (Devon/Wales), BPT
Week 20 - Ex Dorset Leap (Tp level patrolling test ex - Bov Training Area)
Week 21 - BPT, 94 mm LAW training (currently GPMG training), defence lectures, NBC
Week 22 - BPT pass out, NBC, Ex Rorke's Drift (dig & defence ex including NBC)
Week 23 - Ex Violent Entry (OBUA Ex - Sennybridge)
LWEL

Week 24 - LMG (minimi) training, Endurance Course acquaint
Week 25 - 12 mile load carry, amphibious training (Poole), LMG firing & APWA

Module 5 - Commando Course
"To confirm a recruit is professionally prepared for service in an operational unit, is at a Commando level of fitness and has the requisite qualities of determination, courage, unselfishness, professional skill & cheerfulness under adversity"

Week 26 - 6 mile speed march, cliff assault & rope techniques (Foggin Tor), water obstacle crossing, Tarzan & Assault Course instruction, Final Exercise
Week 27 - Final Exercise, specialisations lectures/DSS
LWEL

Week 28 - ECDL computing, Tarzan & Assault & Endurance Course run throughs, drill
Week 29 - Field Firing Ex 1 (individual & fire team level live firing - Dartmoor)
Week 30 - Field Firing Ex 2 (section & troop level live firing - Dartmoor), Endurance Course pass out
Week 31 - Commando Tests, ECDL computing, drill

Module 6 - King's Squad Pass Out Week
"To Pass Out a recruit for duty in a fitting manner"

Week 32 - King's Squad Pass Out Parade & leaving admin

In 1918, King George V visited the Royal Marines depot at Deal in Kent, where he inspected the recruit squads. To mark this visit, the King directed that the senior recruit squad of each intake should be known as The King's Squad, a tradition that continues to the present.

 

[paracowboy]

as I understand it, CSOR is the Canadian answer to the Parachute Regiment, the Ranger Division, and 4 RAR. All three units take recruits right from civvie-street to the unit through a rigourous Selection and Training program. The Yanks and Brits ran it that way for decades. No reason it can't work here.

Except, of course, for the fact that we don't have the manpower in CSOR to run them right from Basic. Or, in the CF at all, really. The schools are drastically under-staffed. And, each of the other units are Infantry only. So, it would necessitate either not allowing other trades to join CSOR, or having some sort of program in place similar to the Yank system.

The beauty of it could be, when wannabe-boy shows up, wanting to go straight to CSOR 'cause he's waayy to cool for Reg'lar Army junk, he signs a special contract that locks him in for 6 years, instead of 3, and when he flunks out, the Army gets to decide where to put him. "Well, you don't seem to have what we need in CSOR, but you DO fit the bill for Fin Clerk. Here's your paperwork."

But it would draw all sorts of recruits. Most wouldn't even begin to have the parts, but they could be shuffled off wherever needed.

 

[GO!!!]

The beauty of it could be, when wannabe-boy shows up, wanting to go straight to CSOR 'cause he's waayy to cool for Reg'lar Army junk, he signs a special contract that locks him in for 6 years, instead of 3, and when he flunks out, the Army gets to decide where to put him. "Well, you don't seem to have what we need in CSOR, but you DO fit the bill for Fin Clerk. Here's your paperwork."

But it would draw all sorts of recruits. Most wouldn't even begin to have the parts, but they could be shuffled off wherever needed.

The problem I see with this is that it would end up being just like the yank system, where what, >1% of entrants actually end up in an SF unit after doing SF entry programs?

I see a few hundred more bitter, disillusioned bags of crap, unable to make it where they want to be, and hating where they are, similar to the handful we have now, moping around the Bns, complaining that the army "lied" to them, and being a headache to whatever supervisor they curse with their presence.

I think the current system is fine, we just need to be realistic about just how many SF soldiers a military our size can support.

 

[Frag7]

Well, I just ask the question to the recruitment office (no answer yet) ;D
After 8 years in the military, a shitload of qualifications and the hope of jumping again, I asked for an exeption on this 2 years rule  :dontpanic: I don't believe in it too much but it worth a try.three years ago I asked the same for JTF2 but that wasn't possible ( but I could skip "selection"  ???). No sandistan at this time, maybe now they need me  :blotto:

I'll let you know

 

[subfighter]

I like paracowboy's ideas on CSOR; think it would be beneficial to both the CF and to the CSOR, perchance even a few recruits make it through the training.

FYI: JTF2's equivalent units in the US are US Navy Special Warfare Development Group (DEVGRU/formerly Seal team 6) and CAG/Delta.  Neither of these units draw from the civilian population to the best of my knowledge, but primarily - not solely - from tier II SF units (e.g. ODAs, blue water SEALS etc.).  I think this policy still best fits our tier I element.

Frag7.  I'm not really sure I understand your post.  However; nobody/nobody skips selection for Assaulter.  And I'm pretty sure the same applies - albeit a different type of selection - for all support positions.    7 days and 7 months, my friend.

 

[RCTRPRODO]

Standby...your prayers have been heard. SAR TECH will be opening soon. You better be fit, know how to skydive and be at least a ParaMedic. The training and selection standards will be high

 

[kincanucks]

Standby...your prayers have been heard. SAR TECH will be opening soon. You better be fit, know how to skydive and be at least a ParaMedic. The training and selection standards will be high

Hmmm thought that they were already accepting direct entry applications for SAR Tech back a few months ago?

 

[subfighter]

Direct entry for SAR Techs?  From civvy to saviour?  Very cool.

 

[Donut]

Ref DE Sar,

Already done.  Several BC paramedics were given offers, I know a couple rejected them, I don't know if anyone took the CF up on it.

I do know that one who was offered it sure as hell has never jumped, never dove, and has some (but not a huge amount of) alpine experience.

DF

 

[The Bread Guy]

Found this piece on the Defensetech.org blog, with an After Action Report (.pdf) from AFG, supporting a call for more DE SF in the USA, on the 6 year model:

"We need to take a revolutionary look at the methods of creating these “Tier One” forces. It will require a separately funded recruiting program similar to WWII OSS programs to identify college graduates, with superb athletic skills, who will volunteer for a 24 month training program (to include total immersion language training in Arabic or Dari) ---followed by a four year employment tour. The financial recruiting incentives of this program would have to reflect the strategic value of the effort to national security. We cannot continue to just find these kinds of operators in the general Army population. The Rangers are already running a separate program that is working reasonably well. "