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Commentary "Why No One Should Join the Canadian Forces"

Infanteer

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RoyalDrew said:
Listen, there is no question that Bruce Moncur was hard done by and I am sorry for what happened to him.  However, what he has presented in his blog is a misinformation piece.  He is a member of the NDP and is towing the party line now as he is one of their candidates.  I'm not saying take what he is saying with a grain of salt, rather understand where he is coming from and maybe contrast that with some stuff you have read here and then formulate your own opinion.

The military is a large organization and for every person you hear saying it sucked and I never want to be part of that organization again, you'll get another person saying it was awesome and the best time of their life.

Only you can decide if you think it's the right fit for you.

This is a pretty good way to sum the debate in this thread up.  I'm watching soldiers in this Army shooting monthly, doing cool things and generally keeping up to speed in what they are supposed to.  Is everything perfect?  Nope.  Is everyone happy?  Nope - but nobody ever is.  Mileage may vary, but it could be a lot worse.  The original author is not doing anyone any favours by saying "no one should join the Canadian Forces".
 

cryco

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Ok, so that's what I think as well from all the reading I've done here.
The thread about using museum parts for repairs, and the reserve recruit that didn't get boots issued are not the norm. I understand that.
I've also read that some of our jets and copters are generations old, they banned alcohol on ships and some coys have idiots as leaders (through their actions, but that happens everywhere).
But there are too many people on here that have had great experiences, seem to be able to help out folks as long as they do some research and can write properly and you ALWAYS help each other out by quoting CANFORGENs (whatever that is) and regulations to get through some sticky situations.
Lots of heated opinions which show  that you are passionate about the CAF and make me want to know more.
So, yea, it's a little unsettling to read something like that because it's sad to know that the bloated powers that be (only saying what i've read) don't see what's going on, or just don't do shit about it. Won't stop me from  trying to get in.
 
J

jollyjacktar

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I have had some of the very best times of my life in the military.  But, I have also had some of the most wretched times of my life here too.  Hopefully the good outweighs the bad at the end of the run.  I'm sure that most everyone else here can say more or less the same.
 

OldSolduer

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jollyjacktar said:
I have had some of the very best times of my life in the military.  But, I have also had some of the most wretched times of my life here too.  Hopefully the good outweighs the bad at the end of the run.  I'm sure that most everyone else here can say more or less the same.
That goes for me as well.

One thing I have to say is that the CF is light years ahead of most organizations for family support for those who have had a family member fall.
 
J

jollyjacktar

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Hamish Seggie said:
That goes for me as well.

One thing I have to say is that the CF is light years ahead of most organizations for family support for those who have had a family member fall.

I suppose it's been a sad necessity that most everyone else has not had to develop.  I do hope, Hamish, that they were there enough for you and your wife when you lost Mike.  I can't think, however, of any other organization that would have enabled you to journey to KAF and visit as you did when I met you. 

I have partaken in the return of the fallen from getting the Chapel ready for the visitation, to the Ramp Ceremony both in KAF and at Mirage to lastly accompanying 6 members home to Trenton where they were given to their respective families.  It all was done with the greatest love and respect for the fallen members and families.  I shall never forget those moments and they are, both, the best and worst of times that I have experienced in my career.
 

Fishbone Jones

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RoyalDrew, and others et al,

You're all absolutely right. I let my emotions get the better of me. It was definitely over the top and totally undeserved for RoyalDrew. I was wrong to call his professionalism and loyalty into question. Every person here is entitled to their opinion and I should not have let my friendship with the author of the article cloud my judgment. Again, I apologize without condition.

I'll top my mea culpa with a self imposed sanction and will remain on listening silence for awhile.

rg
 

daftandbarmy

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My favourite quote:

Q: "Why did you join the infantry?"

A: "Because I get the blow things up and kill people"

That is all  :nod:
 

TCM621

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recceguy said:
RoyalDrew, and others et al,

You're all absolutely right. I let my emotions get the better of me. It was definitely over the top and totally undeserved for RoyalDrew. I was wrong to call his professionalism and loyalty into question. Every person here is entitled to their opinion and I should not have let my friendship with the author of the article cloud my judgment. Again, I apologize without condition.

I'll top my mea culpa with a self imposed sanction and will remain on listening silence for awhile.

rg
Good post. At the end of the day we are all part of the same family and we all want what's best for that family. We can sometimes get a little heated when some of these discussions hit close to home.
 

Good2Golf

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cryco said:
Ok, so that's what I think as well from all the reading I've done here.
The thread about using museum parts for repairs, and the reserve recruit that didn't get boots issued are not the norm. I understand that.
I've also read that some of our jets and copters are generations old, they banned alcohol on ships and some coys have idiots as leaders (through their actions, but that happens everywhere).
But there are too many people on here that have had great experiences, seem to be able to help out folks as long as they do some research and can write properly and you ALWAYS help each other out by quoting CANFORGENs (whatever that is) and regulations to get through some sticky situations.
Lots of heated opinions which show  that you are passionate about the CAF and make me want to know more.
So, yea, it's a little unsettling to read something like that because it's sad to know that the bloated powers that be (only saying what i've read) don't see what's going on, or just don't do shit about it. Won't stop me from  trying to get in.

Infanteer's point about "your mileage may vary" is incredibly true, and relevant to anyone's consideration to join the military.  There are all sorts of shortfalls in the CAF, ranging from equipment to policies to personal support levels, and it is absolutely understandable that someone who has had more difficulties, frictions or frustrations during their service should wish to express their discontent with, at the end of the day, the organization that they chose, in good faith, to serve within.

As do others, I have a great deal of empathy for Mr. Moncur.  He served in good faith and was horribly injured and he was right to expect that he be cared for appropriately.  I give him the benefit of the doubt when he says he was not looked after in the manner that he and others would reasonably expect to be.  It gives cause for one, either still serving or thinking about joining, to consider whether they would be looked after if they were injured.

That said, several serving members have pointed out inconsistencies with, and/or explanations for issues that Mr. Moncur uses to dissuade those who may be considering a career or even a short period of service in the CAF.  In the air force, the C-17 Globemaster, C-130J Hercules and CH-147F Chinook represent brand new, very capable additions to CAF equipment.  Leopard 2 tanks and LAV 6.0 for the Army.  Navy a bit longer lead time, but Canadian Surface Combatant coming as with (arguably problematic) AOPS, etc..., so it's not al doom and gloom for (large) equipment.

It would be nice to see personal support match the equipment-related investment, as it seems this is an area that the Government has some work to do.  Does this make the CAF a "stay away at all costs" proposition?  IMO no, but as others have said, your mileage may vary.  Wishing you all the best with your career, no matter how long it may last.

Regards,
G2G
 

JS2218

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hamiltongs said:
HufPo is a essentially a blog service; they screen the people they let host blogs there to a degree, but there is no editing of content to speak of.

This should be clarified. There is the "news" part of the Huffington Post, where paid reporters report on the news. There is also the "blog" part of the Huffington Post, where unpaid, selected people can publish blogs with their opinions. Usually opinion bloggers are not allowed to cross into reporting "news" and vice versa.

The author of this piece is obviously expressing an "opinion," but by using his credentials could be mistaken by the public as someone knowledgeable (a SME, as someone said earlier). Such is the risk of today's electronic news agencies.
 

Scott

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Posts concerning one guy being an asshole to another have been removed. I did this and if you have an issue with that then PM me.

It's been sorted between the parties.
 

FortYorkRifleman

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Given how many people are trying to get into the CAF I doubt this article will have any bearing on one's decision whether or not to join up. All it does is spread misinformation about the CAF and gives ammunition for those that hate the thought of themselves or their family members joining the military. I remember two summers ago when the RCN had ville de Quebec here along with a ship from the US Coast Guard in Toronto one of the guys in front of me in the line to get in had no idea we HAD a Navy. I'm sure any journalist worth their salt knows how little the Canadian public knows about our military and this author doesn't help it
 

daftandbarmy

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FortYorkRifleman said:
Given how many people are trying to get into the CAF I doubt this article will have any bearing on one's decision whether or not to join up. All it does is spread misinformation about the CAF and gives ammunition for those that hate the thought of themselves or their family members joining the military. I remember two summers ago when the RCN had ville de Quebec here along with a ship from the US Coast Guard in Toronto one of the guys in front of me in the line to get in had no idea we HAD a Navy. I'm sure any journalist worth their salt knows how little the Canadian public knows about our military and this author doesn't help it

Based on how I managed to attract women at one point on my (single) life, the best way to get people to want to do something is to tell them NOT to  ;D
 

FortYorkRifleman

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daftandbarmy said:
Based on how I managed to attract women at one point on my (single) life, the best way to get people to want to do something is to tell them NOT to  ;D

If I went by that logic I'd be trying to join as an Infantry Officer  :eek: Although there is nothing wrong with that  :salute:
 
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