Canadians are culturally sensitive to others.

[Bograt]

I read this article online today:

PUBLICATION:  The Edmonton Sun 
DATE:  2005.08.24
EDITION:  Final 
SECTION:  News 
PAGE:  22 
ILLUSTRATION: photo of BILL GRAHAM Turned corner 
SOURCE:  BY CP 
DATELINE:  MOOSE JAW 

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DEFENCE MINISTER SINGS PRAISES OF CANUCK SOLDIERS IN AFGHANISTAN

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Canada's defence minister illustrated how Canadians are well-suited to their mission in Afghanistan by telling a story yesterday about a soldier who spared a child's life.

Graham, who was visiting the Canadian Forces air base in Moose Jaw, said the Canadian soldier in Kabul risked his life to take a machine-gun from a 12-year-old boy.

He said the soldier told him: "I figured it was better to risk my life than to shoot a 12-year-old boy."

Graham said because of their values, training and experience, Canadians are culturally sensitive to others. He said some armed forces don't behave that way.

"They shoot first and ask questions later," Graham said.

Graham, who was speaking at a luncheon, also noted that one of the greatest attributes that the Forces have is an international reputation, which is derived from an ability to work with other people towards a common cause.

Canada has 250 soldiers in Kandahar that are part of a reconstruction team that will also involve members of the RCMP, Foreign Affairs and the Canadian International Development Agency.

They're trying to bring stability to the area prior to national elections in September.

Graham also reiterated a pledge to speed up the time frame for acquiring new equipment for the armed forces.

He said after a long time when government put other priorities first, $13.5 billion over five years was made available this spring in extra defence funding.

"One of the problems of procurement in the military is it takes time. The average military acquisition of any significance in this country takes 12 years. My job as defence minister is to cut that time back," Graham said.

Canada can't wait 12 years to get new helicopters or replace the aging <Hercules> transport fleet, he said. "I strongly believe we have turned the corner in terms of ensuring our military is better supplied," he said

I distinctly remember an account a Sergent told me during a field ex de-brief. He presented a situation that happened to him while in Croatia. A 8 or 9 year old boy appeared out of a shack, and pointed a RPG at his APC. He redundantly asked "What would you do...?" We paused... He said, "I know what I did, and I don't regret it ." The implication was clear.

In this the circumstance that MDN presented is a political mirage. To suggest that we are somehow more culturally sensitive than other armies (a clear knock against our allies) is symbolic of the myth the Liberal machine creates. I am sure that if in the above circumstance, the 12 year pointed his weapon, the account would not have been shared over roast beef and cheesecake.

My 2 cents.

 

[Cloud Cover]

Get used to it for the next little while. An election is 6 months off.

 

[Michael Dorosh]

We don't really consider it bad that corporate memory has forgotten the "shoot them between the skirts and the flip-flops" order, do we?

 

[2 Cdo]

The liberal Canadian myth being held out as some kind of Holy Grail. There is definitely an election on the horizon with this drivel being spouted! :rage:

 

[Britney Spears]

I don't see how the example supports the premesis. There's nothing "culturally sensitive" about not wanting to shoot children. I don't know of any civilized culture that condones that sort of thing.

 

[Michael Dorosh]

The liberal Canadian myth being held out as some kind of Holy Grail. There is definitely an election on the horizon with this drivel being spouted! :rage:

What kind of myth would you like to see perpetuated?  Perhaps the Sven Hassel myth that Canadians tie their prisoners to the front of their tanks with barbed wire?  As far as myths go, the benevolent, peace loving myth is pretty harmless.  At the very least, it gets our tourists better treatment than the Americans get.

So, seriously, what kind of myths would you like people to have about us?

 

[JasonH]

Bwahaaha

 

[Infanteer]

So, seriously, what kind of myths would you like people to have about us?

How about no myths - as Britney pointed out, the soldier didn't shoot the kid because of some unique Canadian trait.  And as others have pointed out, the situation could have easily ended differently - if a kid points a gun at soldiers, he is liable to get shot (read your Blackhawk Down).

 

[medicineman]

I fail to see the co-relation between discretion in the use of force and cultural sensitivity (or did I just miss the point?) - only thing culturally I see here is a person who likely hasn't been exposed much to kiddly widdlees running around shooting at people with AK's.  I'm sure some people that had been in Rwanda or Sierra Leone or The Congo may have reacted differently, given the number of child "soldiers" in those places.  Perhaps then Mr Graham would understand why some soldiers would be more apt to shoot first...

MM

 

[paracowboy]

So, seriously, what kind of myths would you like people to have about us?

that we are the greatest lovers in the world.

 

[Infanteer]

that we are the greatest lovers in the world.

And that we have a musky natural body odor, many leather bound books, and an apartment that smells of rich mahogany....

 

[Armymedic]

So, seriously, what kind of myths would you like people to have about us?

We are dominate in sports other then hockey.

 

[jmacleod]

Graham is shown today sitting in a 431 Squadron CT-114 at Moose Jaw. Don't know the man at
all, but we deal with DND and other Ottawa based HQ's etc. all the time. Impression is that
Graham only has a passing interest in DND, is seeking a change in venue - much of which is
probably being discussed in Regina as I write this. In any event, I do not think that Canadians
are culturally sensitive to others, certainly not as a general rule, where immigrants for the most
part from the Middle East for instance, tend not to attempt to blend in. But years ago, when
the first wave of immigrants from Syria and Lebanon settled in the Atlantic region, they blended
into the typical Canadian neighbourhoods within a decade - the family of the late Premier Joseph
Ghiz is an example of that. The big political problem to cultural sensitivity is in Toronto, where
profiling of hoodlums is essential to clear the streets of killers with guns, but Toronto politicians
in their quest for absolute equality will not provide the necessary authority, and the courts are
a sad commentary of the application of the Criminal Code. The citizens of Toronto the Good
however have no qualms in insisting that the streets are cleaned up - a change in political direction
is necessary. MacLeod
MacLeod

 

[Mineguy]

Sad to say but I think tis going to take canada getting hit at home bad or a long and drawn out infantry war where we have alot of troops killed in large numbers before the light is seen by these politicans, and even then i dont know, and first they would have to actually let us get involved in that type of deal(what ms parrish calls peacemaking, like the house to house peacemaking in cassino or ortona) which i know they would try hard not to let happen even if it was on our doorstep for fear of loosing their pensions over as canadas just not agressive so they say, and we are born culturally senstive. Once as like in vietnam when child soldiers are doing the shooting along with adults and we are in a place (like where we are already) where child soldiers are being used or have been used, and children exploited for violent missions by the enemy (as we also are) this train of thought will go on until finnaly people start thinking of going home alive first after one a of the kids shoots and kills while they hesitate or think the kid is inquisitvly playing around with an ak they found, which is entirely possible of course. But who am i to judge the guys decision and the ground truth, im not on ground and im not him at that moment. But im pretty sure when its down to the 5 yard line our guys are no diffrent in the brain then any other soldier when their life is in danger and they find themsleves in the wrong place at the right time and that we as cdns dont possess this new thing mr graham says we have (and i guess mentally that deters him and the public from thinking we really are actually targets and they can sleep nice) and nobody else does although we may have had some better experience with peacekeeping ops which helps. I think it just boils down to common sense and how the situation unfolds to the decsion made to shoot or not.

 

[beach_bum]

that we are the greatest lovers in the world.

That's not a myth though.    It's a fact.  A long winter means practice makes perfect.  8)

 

[Michael Dorosh]

That's not a myth though.    It's a fact.  A long winter means practice makes perfect.  8)

I think the principles espoused by Starland Vocal Band apply here - seasonally as well as time of day.  If you're only doing it in the winter, you may want to see a specialist. 

 

[beach_bum]

LOL  Winter is just more practice for the summer!    The only problem is that the water beckons me now........the perfect wave......

 

[Cloud Cover]

Sad to say but I think tis going to take canada getting hit at home bad or a long and drawn out infantry war where we have alot of troops killed in large numbers before the light is seen by these politicans, and even then i dont know, and first they would have to actually let us get involved in that type of deal(what ms parrish calls peacemaking, like the house to house peacemaking in cassino or ortona) which i know they would try hard not to let happen even if it was on our doorstep for fear of loosing their pensions over as canadas just not agressive so they say, and we are born culturally senstive. Once as like in vietnam when child soldiers are doing the shooting along with adults and we are in a place (like where we are already) where child soldiers are being used or have been used, and children exploited for violent missions by the enemy (as we also are) this train of thought will go on until finnaly people start thinking of going home alive first after one a of the kids shoots and kills while they hesitate or think the kid is inquisitvly playing around with an ak they found, which is entirely possible of course. But who am i to judge the guys decision and the ground truth, im not on ground and im not him at that moment. But im pretty sure when its down to the 5 yard line our guys are no diffrent in the brain then any other soldier when their life is in danger and they find themsleves in the wrong place at the right time and that we as cdns dont possess this new thing mr graham says we have (and i guess mentally that deters him and the public from thinking we really are actually targets and they can sleep nice) and nobody else does although we may have had some better experience with peacekeeping ops which helps. I think it just boils down to common sense and how the situation unfolds to the decsion made to shoot or not.

'Lord tundering Jesus Laddie... wot are ya' trying ta say wit all dis floatsom?

 

[Mineguy]

Its was a little indepth but basically the same as a few others because these politicans really get me going..  .

Here we had a soldier threatened, child with the weapon, the child can still be possibly meaning bussniss, the soldier made the choice with his common sense and waited for the outcome. Which could have been the other way but if you do somthing a certain way youre a hero but you could do the same thing another way and be seen from higher the oppisite quite possibly depending on the outcome. This choice wasnt made because we are born or bestowed with some specail blessed gift of being more sensitive then other nations when threatened in real life which mr graham says it was its all about the situation and common sense. Its clear that mr graham still does not understand the choices our guys are making out there, what this mission is all about and the threat and the cdn soldiers true purpose in life and this may be due to hes just another naieve re educated canadian or he has a passing intrest all of the sudden (because its gonna help him in the vote and thus protect his pension and standing amongst his buddies) from being all touchy feely about the subject. If cdn troops ever get into an area where theres heavy close quarters combat child soldiers are fighting alongside the adults then  like the usa experienced  in vietnam with child soldiers and one of our guys gets killed by a child then i think the fact that its a child with a weapon wont matter anymore. But its entirely up to the guys on the ground for the choices made due to the threat as they see it.

 

[bossi]

... In this the circumstance that MDN presented is a political mirage. To suggest that we are somehow more culturally sensitive than other armies (a clear knock against our allies) is symbolic of the myth the Liberal machine creates. ...

Not sure which point to address first ...
Okay - re: "knock against our allies" - personally, I've lost my inferiority complex with regard to comparing our Canadian Army against many other.

Now, as to "culturally sensitive" - well, I have to admit I've seen cultural insensitivity under many flags - however, at the opposite end of that spectrum I'd rank our CIMIC with the world's best (and, oddly enough, that's a view shared by quite a few of ... our allies).

For to win one hundred victories in one hundred battles is not the acme of skill. To subdue the enemy without fighting is the acme of skill.
-- Sun Tzu.

$0.02