Arty Officer Update

[Meridian]

Hi all...

Upon hearing that CEOTP armour is no longer available, but that ARTY certainly is, I've been doing some more investigation on the ARTY side of things. Unfortunately, it would appear this is a quieter side of army.ca

A few questions I'm hoping someone can provide me recent answers with:

1 - Do all Field Arty O's at some point do the FOO thing? (I know this was the case previously, but Im curious if its still true).  I'd like to spend a bit of time at the pointy end of things just to crush that hunger, but realize it wouldn't be for very long.

2 - What is life like for an STA Officer? Doesn't seem to be much talk at all about that around here. Same for AD?

3 - Is there still a choice of which "Stream" you take in DP1.2?

 

[Ralph]

1 - Do all Field Arty O's at some point do the FOO thing? (I know this was the case previously, but Im curious if its still true).  I'd like to spend a bit of time at the pointy end of things just to crush that hunger, but realize it wouldn't be for very long.

Yes. Normally after a couple years as a TC.

2 - What is life like for an STA Officer? Doesn't seem to be much talk at all about that around here. Same for AD?

Staying within my lanes, STA is brand new and I don't believe any pointyheads have taken the STA Tp Comd course yet, so they're learning at the same time as their troops on the ground at the regiments. As for AD, maybe one of them will weigh in.

3 - Is there still a choice of which "Stream" you take in DP1.2?

I did it in the couple years when everybody automatically went Field, so again, maybe somebody who's very recently graduated can say - I would guess it's like the posting preference. If it fits with what they want, you get it. Otherwise, TS. If you express an extremely strong desire right from the start for any of the three, that will help. Or won't hurt, at least...
Cheers.

 

[dunkski]

Upon hearing that CEOTP armour is no longer available

Did you by chance hear which other MOC's aren't available for CEOTP this year?

 

[dunkski]

sorry...meant to place Meridian's sentence as a quote...

 

[Meridian]

Thanks Ralph for the info.  I'm actually getting pretty interested in Arty now... it was my second choice after Armour for ROTP too... Infantry has always been a lofty third

Only Cbt Arms trade open for CEOTP right now is Arty, and even there, its only 3 spots (as of 19 Jul).
That said, the CFRC (a LT, and two Sgts) both chimed in to say it doesnt hurt to apply to all of your choices, because apparently there is an upswing in people jumping out at the last second or going AWOL before showing up to St Jean, etc. Not to mention increased course failures.

 

[Petard]

  I'd like to spend a bit of time at the pointy end of things just to crush that hunger, but realize it wouldn't be for very long.

Interesting that you reveal some assumptions that you've made, and unfortunately many others still hold; that the only ones in the Artillery that deal with the pointy end are FOO parties, and the Gun line is somewhere safe "behind the lines" out of contact.

Well here's a western union for you, the gun troops don't have it so nice either. When they rotate through a FOB, not so bad, but they don't stay there. And before somebody tries to dog pile me with "oh yeah, well they don't have it as bad as ...(fill in your combat arm of choice)", I'm not saying they have it worse than others, just that its not easy like a lot still seem to be thinking, and consequently this BS continues.

If you make it through the Field side of officer training you might be lucky enough to find yourself leading a Gun Troop through very hostile terrain to an austere gun position where the only people you have to defend that spot is yourselves, and you may be there quite a well, and you are more than likely to find yourself dealing with things that you didn't even know that Artillery units deal with, things that you would associate with "the pointy end".

 

[Petard]

Here's a video put together by one of the fellows from roto 1, not too much has changed for the lads on the current one; gives you an idea of the conditions a gun troop operates in
http://youtube.com/watch?v=hy_4269u-ZM

 

[Mike Baker]

Great video, thanks.

 

[Meridian]

Petard - Thanks for the follow-up.  I have been subsquently doing a fair amount of Arty-related research around here and such (via PMs, etc) and did see that Arty video on youtube (and basically every other one I could find using various keywords).

My apologies for making assumptions; most of them were really based on comments and attitudes in previous threads here, so I guess the stereotype persists.  My read the other day of that AAR-like posting from an austere mission up with American Special Forces really drove home that indeed the Arty folks are part of the "pointy end", even if their end of it is a bit more blunt sometimes

In actuality, I suppose some of my concerns about operational missions is the use of Arty and more particularly heavy/indirect fire in non-traditional fighting situations.  By this I am getting at perhaps a bit more of where I "presume" Canada will be headed in the longer future with light, expeditionary type forces operating in insurgent, urban-heavy type settings.  Whether this is actually the case is worthy of many other topics of discussions, but its where my current opinion/guesstimate of where we are going lies,  so I'm interested in identifying how Arty will be used to accomplish those missions in the future.

 

[Meridian]

If you make it through the Field side of officer training you might be lucky enough....austere.....

This is, indeed, an example of what I'm curious about.  Luck in your statement can be construed to mean two very different things;  in one way one could take it that I would be very blessed for the opportunity to do so (which I agree with), and the other could mean that no matter the effort and skill put forth, the chances of actually leading a gun troop through the battlefield is minimal.

We all know officer tasks are admin heavy... I'm simply curious about how operationally forward they are.

 

[Petard]

Let me spell it out for you then.
Shake this crap of "how operationally forward are they?" I have heard enough of this garbage from fellow combat arms over the last little while, none of whom have paid any attention to what has been going on recently. They hang onto some long obsolete idea of what they think Artillery is or does, which has no basis on the current reality.

You, and they, don't get it. There is no longer a who is "operationally forward" or not anymore. Potentially anyone deployed is. Some carry a heavier load than others to be sure, no doubt as always the PBI have it the worst. But it sure ain't what it used to be for the Artillery either.
 
Luck? Make it through your training, and if there is a mission like the current one still going on, you will definitely be in amongst what you're looking for, although there will also be admin clagg to sort as well.
But consider this though: in the past year and 1/2 gun troops have deployed under direct and indirect fire, shot their way out of ambushes, engaged targets with direct fire with their guns and been in life and death duels with mortars. They have had to count on solid leadership and technical skills amongst themselves to see them through long periods of isolation from the remainder of the battle group, while still supporting it with indirect fire. Is that enough of being "in it" for you?

Kind of like marriage. No one will know for sure how it is going to turn out, but go for it only if you believe in truly giving it a chance, not because you couldn't get into what you really wanted to. Believe me, the soldiers will be on to you in no time, and you will not be leading anyone if your heart's not in it. Your life, and more importantly theirs, depends on your honesty with yourself.

 

[Disenchantedsailor]

Well put

 

[Meridian]

Petard -

Thanks for the honesty, it is exactly what I am looking for. I certainly am not asking for an "all sunshine and lollipops" type discourse with anyone out here, just really what its like for the boots on the ground.

It is unfortunate that there is not greater visibility on just what the Arty has been doing for the CF and the all-arms battle, especially in recent times.  Perhaps that is what is truly the best part of the Arty - they do their job, they do their job well, and they don't whine and...  about not being lauded for it.  Maybe I'm out to lunch, but that is the type of impression I'm starting to get, and its an impression I definitely like.

I will never accept a position in the CF that does not fully meet my expectations, dreams and desires. This is the benefit of a volunteer, professional army, and it is a big reason why I believe we as Canadians should be so proud of our men and women who are so lauded throughout the world, by ally and enemy alike.

Thanks again.

 

[Blue Trapper]

Petrad,
          Thanks for the video,after seeing that,I miss the GUNS and the Regt,lots of familiar faces in the 1 RCHA ones
          Like they say once a Gunner always a Gunner.

 

[Bounce]

Here's a video put together by one of the fellows from roto 1, not too much has changed for the lads on the current one; gives you an idea of the conditions a gun troop operates in
http://youtube.com/watch?v=hy_4269u-ZM

the video was removed, don't suppose you have another link to it?

 

[observor 69]

I liked this one:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ldVtte9jK-s

 

[Petard]

Except for the bad gun drill  ???
- 1 guy ramming
- round on the loading tray while firing
- propellant left on the equilibrator while firing (which tumbles into the cradle as the gun goes back into battery)