All things Novel Coronavirus (2019-nCoV)

[brihard]

And you have just proved the absurdity of how unions will fight this, which was my original premise. Thanks

No... What he’s talking about is already covered under the Treasury Board’s directions on COVID, including the ‘699’ leave code.

Unions may or may not fight this. PSAC has already shown they will not, others remain to be seen, but PSAC will be a bellwether in this. Unions may not fight it much at all.

 

[Weinie]

No... What he’s talking about is already covered under the Treasury Board’s directions on COVID, including the ‘699’ leave code.

Unions may or may not fight this. PSAC has already shown they will not, others remain to be seen, but PSAC will be a bellwether in this. Unions may not fight it much at all.

Well, we will see.

 

[brihard]

Well, we will see.

Yup. I’m in a pretty good position to see some of it and I’ll let you know.

What I think is more likely is that, rather than a wholesale objection to the policy writ large, unions may be more likely to keep their heads mostly down and individually represent/defend members who buck the policy and end up facing discipline.

 

[Bruce Monkhouse]

The Unions kind of tied their own hands to fight ordered vaccinations by [rightly] demanding safer workplaces.........."here, roll up your sleeves and let us help you with that."

 

[Fishbone Jones]

That's the way I read it.

Use your mod powers and merge them then. This thread is All Things Corona, including politics. Not, Some Things Corona, so that political thread belongs here, IMO. Again, YMMV.

 

[Altair]

Use your mod powers and merge them then. This thread is All Things Corona, including politics. Not, Some Things Corona, so that political thread belongs here, IMO. Again, YMMV.

Good point.

SARS‑CoV‑2 Medical Talk

army.ca

 

[Altair]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1408729052295303171

Explains the large spike in cases and hospitalizations going on in the USA.

 

[Altair]

Column: Major study of ivermectin, the anti-vaccine crowd's latest COVID drug, finds 'no effect whatsoever'

Ivermectin, touted as a treatment of COVID by the anti-vaccine crowd, has "no effect," according to a major study.

www.latimes.com

Yet to be peer reviewed, so grains of salt should be taken, but not a good sign for Ivermectin.

 

[Quirky]

Hmm. I'd agree, with a caveat. When the PS is ready to sign that unlimited liability contract, then they can equate their jobs to the military. Technically, it may be that the CAF is a PS job, but I've always considered our station in life as something more important and a much higher calling than that of a public servant. Probably doesn't mean much to the conversation or a dead end tangent. While our wage and some other stuff is tied to the PS, the military has always been a very different beast, unique to our profession. Nothing else compares to it. Just my opinion based on personal bias.

Based on my own personal bias, I completely disagree. Unless someone in the CAF goes looking for deployments where people are shooting back, the unlimited liability means absolutely jack sh*t. You pick your trade, you know the dangers associated with it. There are times when working conditions are terrible, but 99.9% of the time, your life isn’t in any serious danger from any sort of enemy. I think many members of the CAF are self-entitled - almost all of those have never worked, or been exposed to, a civy job and don’t know just how easy they have it. Some of the complaints I’ve heard over my years are disgusting; the amount of special treatment we get is incredible. Grocery store workers for example never worked from home and got full pay during the pandemic to stay home. If the PS has forced vaccinations, we should too. Get jabbed or get out.

 

[Altair]

Good point.

SARS‑CoV‑2 Medical Talk

army.ca

seems like my thread on Covid only medical talk got merged into this one, which kind of makes it seem like this is the medical talk one @Fishbone Jones

 

[The Bread Guy]

The Unions kind of tied their own hands to fight ordered vaccinations by [rightly] demanding safer workplaces.........."here, roll up your sleeves and let us help you with that."

#BeCarefulWhatYouWishFor

 

[Scott]

Yup. I’m in a pretty good position to see some of it and I’ll let you know.

What I think is more likely is that, rather than a wholesale objection to the policy writ large, unions may be more likely to keep their heads mostly down and individually represent/defend members who buck the policy and end up facing discipline.

Work email notifications on a Saturday will always get my attention. I read the three I have about this and am soon logging back off because I'm expecting the same as above. It will be individual cases/accommodations - and management has already accepted this, and are preparing for it. Everything else that has come up as what we thought was a show stopper has so far proven to be easy. There's been a metric fuckload of good old fashioned cooperation (at times).

I'm going disc golfing.

 

[The Bread Guy]

This from the PSAC info-machine so far ....

... PSAC supports measures to increase vaccination rates, including vaccination requirements for federal public service workers to protect our members, their colleagues, and our communities.

Governments and employers have an obligation to ensure our workplaces are safe for public service workers and Canadians everywhere.

Although we support the goals of the government’s proposal, it’s critical that any eventual plan put forward by the government that would collect or verify the vaccination or medical status of our members respects their legal right to privacy. The government must also provide accommodations for workers who cannot be vaccinated for reasons protected under human rights legislation.

We expect the government to continue consulting with unions on the implementation of their vaccination requirements to safeguard our members’ right to privacy and ensure that their human rights are respected ...

 

[Fishbone Jones]

Based on my own personal bias, I completely disagree. Unless someone in the CAF goes looking for deployments where people are shooting back, the unlimited liability means absolutely jack sh*t. You pick your trade, you know the dangers associated with it. There are times when working conditions are terrible, but 99.9% of the time, your life isn’t in any serious danger from any sort of enemy. I think many members of the CAF are self-entitled - almost all of those have never worked, or been exposed to, a civy job and don’t know just how easy they have it. Some of the complaints I’ve heard over my years are disgusting; the amount of special treatment we get is incredible. Grocery store workers for example never worked from home and got full pay during the pandemic to stay home. If the PS has forced vaccinations, we should too. Get jabbed or get out.

My wife works at a grocery store. They were considered essential workers. She has worked through the whole pandemic for minimum wage. She never got to stay home and collect anything. You can have your own personal opinion, but before you decide to deride others, get your facts sorted out. It affects the credibility of your other opinions on the subject.

 

[mariomike]

I can't answer for Quirky, but I think s/he was saying our Essential Workers are heroes.

That's the way I understood it.

I think every sensible person feels that way.

First responder? Essential worker? Healthcare provider? After all you did during COVID, after all the sacrifice, and all the pain, the grateful public has joined together to let you know ...there is no way you are getting a monument.

Locals Protest Cuomo's Plan To Install Essential Workers Monument In Battery Park City

"I have enormous respect for essential workers, but the plan here would ruin an amazing green space in Battery Park."

gothamist.com

I would not begrudge them a pay raise either.

 

[Quirky]

My wife works at a grocery store. They were considered essential workers. She has worked through the whole pandemic for minimum wage. She never got to stay home and collect anything. You can have your own personal opinion, but before you decide to deride others, get your facts sorted out. It affects the credibility of your other opinions on the subject.

I can't answer for Quirky, but I think s/he was saying our Essential Workers are heroes.

This. Along with the medical workers who never stopped in 2020, the grocery store workers, truck drivers, hell the people working at fast-food joints and liquor stores were all still working during the entire pandemic. The vast majority of the CF were "preserving the force" by sitting at home and day-drinking, many still work from home depending on the unit.

With the CF now mandated to get Covid shots, anyone refusing can be shown the door, we don't need any dead weight.

 

[Brad Sallows]

"Grocery store workers for example never worked from home and got full pay during the pandemic to stay home."

A bit confusing. How I understand it:

Some people "worked from home and got full pay during the pandemic to stay home."

Grocery store workers were not among the "some people" (so they neither worked from home nor got paid to stay home).

 

[Remius]

I understood exactly what he was saying and he has a point.

 

[Scott]

Remove the P-word if it offends you. Substitute any other job classification. The language remains the same.

But you are still giving your examples based on your time with TEMS. It is simply not relevant. At all.

We have different regulations and codes we adhere to when you're a federal employee.

So the differences start before we even discuss what was already (by my experience) a terribly hypothetical situation - it all started with someone being "ordered" to work while under quarantine. Something like 400 medics in the big smoke were told to get to work, and that they had to take some measures. How long did SARS last again? Covid's been a touch different.

I know of one agency with close to 50,000 employees. I don't even know how many job descriptions. This has never been a consideration. Full stop. Not once. Not even gamed out. The unions we work with have been great throughout. We congratulate them for that, and should.

 

[mariomike]

I asked a question:

Do federal unions have Working Quarantine Pay in their collective agreements?

You answered it.:

This has never been a consideration. Full stop. Not once. Not even gamed out.

Thank-you.