AESOp ( MOC 081)

[DAA]

So I was just able to get some info. Though the info I got was not very reassuring.

They have my application in Ottawa. The reason I haven’t heard anything else yet is because there were no positions available last year. IF there’s any new positions this year they will announce those in April. The person I spoke to said there’s a pretty high chance there won’t be more positions this year. If there are the chances I would be selected are very low, because I'm untrained coming from ResF (even though I have 3yrs RegF time). She said if I don’t hear anything in April to contact her in May to discuss “other options”. FML  :facepalm:

Let me say, that if you are enrolling off  the street, then the "information you got was WRONG!!!"  However, if you are applying as a Component Transfer, then that is a different story.

AES Op is currently OPEN for processing through CFRC's, there are positions for the coming year (ie; BMQ starting after 1 Apr 14) available and, the bad news, the selection date for next years positions is scheduled for 1 Feb 14!

 

[TUNETOG]

Let me say, that if you are enrolling off  the street, then the "information you got was WRONG!!!"  However, if you are applying as a Component Transfer, then that is a different story.

AES Op is currently OPEN for processing through CFRC's, there are positions for the coming year (ie; BMQ starting after 1 Apr 14) available and, the bad news, the selection date for next years positions is scheduled for 1 Feb 14!

I thought they had closed the trade to DE's. Oh well. I'm coming from ResF. Which to me is a bit crazy, that they'll take DE's over a CT/OT who already has 8yrs military experience (RegF and ResF). Has BMQ done, and so could start the trades training right away. It'd be in the CF's interest and would save them time/money. But then again, those of us with experience know how this system works.

Are available positions posted anywhere? ARRRGGGHHHHH Why isn't this process more transparent? Seems like they're treating DE's better than those of us already serving.....

Sorry, I'm just pretty frustrated after speaking with D MIL C.

:threat:

 

[TUNETOG]

Well that isn't good news at all. I've been looking to CT into this trade for over a year now,  I've been trying to line it up with my university degree. I think I know who you are from the lounge. I'll put my CT next time I'm in the unit based on that news.

Best of luck.

Yup, I think we're the only active people over there.  :nod:

 

[DAA]

I thought they had closed the trade to DE's. Oh well. I'm coming from ResF. Which to me is a bit crazy, that they'll take DE's over a CT/OT who already has 8yrs military experience (RegF and ResF). Has BMQ done, and so could start the trades training right away. It'd be in the CF's interest and would save them time/money. But then again, those of us with experience know how this system works.
Are available positions posted anywhere? ARRRGGGHHHHH Why isn't this process more transparent? Seems like they're treating DE's better than those of us already serving.....
Sorry, I'm just pretty frustrated after speaking with D MIL C.
:threat:

I'm kind of surprised that they don't have their CT numbers for the coming year yet.  I know that the "forecasted" numbers are available on the DWAN but these are not entirely accurate all the time.  When DMCPG 5 gets the thumbs up to start working on CT files, I have no idea.

 

[Cbbmtt]

When I went through the interview process for DE into AESOP and ACOP I was told that I would be competing against people that wanted to CT into the occupation. However, if the Forces member didn't have any experience with radar or the AESOP position then we would all be competing on the same level. CFAT and Air Crew Medical and so forth.

I had the option of waiting till next year when the job opened again with no guarantees or to take ACOP so ACOP I go

Good luck Tune, hope you get it this year.

 

[TUNETOG]

I'm kind of surprised that they don't have their CT numbers for the coming year yet.

I'm sure there's a link somewhere that you can view what/where positions are available. I may very well have been geting brushed off by the staff in Ottawa since I went directly to them. Though I was trying to sort out a clerical error on their end.

Luckily, by nature of the place where I work, I have access to people who know people in the trade. People with more knowledge/contacts/pull than I have. So i've asked them if they can do a little digging for me to find out any info they can. Again, why this process isn't more transparent I don't know.

 

[DAA]

I'm sure there's a link somewhere that you can view what/where positions are available. I may very well have been geting brushed off by the staff in Ottawa since I went directly to them. Though I was trying to sort out a clerical error on their end.

Luckily, by nature of the place where I work, I have access to people who know people in the trade. People with more knowledge/contacts/pull than I have. So i've asked them if they can do a little digging for me to find out any info they can. Again, why this process isn't more transparent I don't know.

It's always been my understanding that the CT process is between the member and their "CT Broker" who works in DMCPG 5 and direct contact is encouraged seeing as they are the only ones who can answer your questions as they hold your CT Application.

 

[TUNETOG]

It's always been my understanding that the CT process is between the member and their "CT Broker" who works in DMCPG 5 and direct contact is encouraged seeing as they are the only ones who can answer your questions as they hold your CT Application.

It'd be nice if I had a broker. Here's my story. Put in my CT/OT through the online application in June '13. Got an email from D MIL C7 in October saying I needed to be sure my MPRR/MED etc was up to date and that MCpl **** was my POC at my unit to ensure all this was done. But they sent it to the wrong MCpl ****. So I went to my CC and did it through them. All my stuff is up to date, and asked my CC to let D MIL C7 know all my info is good to go and they can set up an interview with CFRC. I have not heard anything since. I have not been assisgned a broker at all. Since I don't necessarily trust the CC at my unit I contacted D MIL C7 today, which is where I got the information I posted above.

 

[Eye In The Sky]

CT's are generally grouped into 2 catagories from what I can see;  CT (T) and CT (UT).  T = Trained.  UT = Untrained.

The only CT (T)s that happen in our trade are people who were Reg Force AES Ops, who've CT'd to the PRes side, who then CT back to Reg Force (not common but has happened).  This type of CT applicant can basically be posted on CT and will have to knock some rust of the skillset, etc but is a trained/proven operator.

Any other CT would be a CT (UT).  This applicant has to do the whole gammit of training; there is quite of bit of it and it is rather expensive because of the nature of it.  I.E. flying costs money.

I don't know the rhyme or reason of it, but each year the 4 entry paths into the AES Op trade (OT Reg Force, CT(T) PREs, CT (UT) PRes, and DE) are all given numbers of people allowed in thru each.  Why?  I don't know.  How it is determined?  Sounds like a question for a PSO or someone to me.  I have no idea.

The SIP usually details the Internal/External numbers for any CAF trade per FY.  CTs fall under External IIRC.

I had a bit of a fight to get into the trade, but I can look now and say it was absolutely worth it. 

 

[TUNETOG]

CT's are generally grouped into 2 catagories from what I can see;  CT (T) and CT (UT).  T = Trained.  UT = Untrained.

The only CT (T)s that happen in our trade are people who were Reg Force AES Ops, who've CT'd to the PRes side, who then CT back to Reg Force (not common but has happened).  This type of CT applicant can basically be posted on CT and will have to knock some rust of the skillset, etc but is a trained/proven operator.

Any other CT would be a CT (UT).  This applicant has to do the whole gammit of training; there is quite of bit of it and it is rather expensive because of the nature of it.  I.E. flying costs money.

I don't know the rhyme or reason of it, but each year the 4 entry paths into the AES Op trade (OT Reg Force, CT(T) PREs, CT (UT) PRes, and DE) are all given numbers of people allowed in thru each.  Why?  I don't know.  How it is determined?  Sounds like a question for a PSO or someone to me.  I have no idea.

The SIP usually details the Internal/External numbers for any CAF trade per FY.  CTs fall under External IIRC.

I had a bit of a fight to get into the trade, but I can look now and say it was absolutely worth it.

Hey Eye In The Sky,

I do get all of that. Like when I mentioned I was told there's only 2 spots/yr for CT(UT) from PRes. I think you're eluding to the transparency side of things I was talking about. Correct me if I'm wrong.

What I'm saying is that it'd be nice if someone could give a clear answer to each step in the process, and then for the member to be able to follow along in that process and see the progression, or lack thereof on their file. In my case the ball was dropped from the start in that they sent my initial email to the wrong person when giving me a POC to be sure my info was all up to date. Had I not chased things down I'd still be sitting here like a good troop waiting to hear back from someone that doesn't have anything to do with my unit, file or CT's.

I understand the process can take some time. That one might not get in on the first go round. I feel though that from the first meeting with the BPSO to even find out how to submit a CT (which took 3 weeks to get an appt. itself) I've hit a stumbling block every time. Now it seems if I don't get an interview before next month I'm waiting at least another year before my file will even be seen. All because of clerical errors and misinformation. Not because I've had something missing on my MPRR or my medical (which I'll have to do again if/when I miss this cycle). That's why this process is frustrating. Maybe I should release and just waltz into a recruiting centre, and DE. lol.


Again I'm sorry, but after today I need somewhere to vent. Once again… FML  :facepalm:

 

[Eye In The Sky]

What I'm saying is that it'd be nice if someone could give a clear answer to each step in the process, and then for the member to be able to follow along in that process and see the progression, or lack thereof on their file. In my case the ball was dropped from the start in that they sent my initial email to the wrong person when giving me a POC to be sure my info was all up to date. Had I not chased things down I'd still be sitting here like a good troop waiting to hear back from someone that doesn't have anything to do with my unit, file or CT's.

I've learned to accept that no one in the CF is going to look after my personal interests better than I am. 

I understand the process can take some time. That one might not get in on the first go round. I feel though that from the first meeting with the BPSO to even find out how to submit a CT (which took 3 weeks to get an appt. itself) I've hit a stumbling block every time. Now it seems if I don't get an interview before next month I'm waiting at least another year before my file will even be seen. All because of clerical errors and misinformation. Not because I've had something missing on my MPRR or my medical (which I'll have to do again if/when I miss this cycle). That's why this process is frustrating. Maybe I should release and just waltz into a recruiting centre, and DE. lol.


Again I'm sorry, but after today I need somewhere to vent. Once again… FML  :facepalm:

You should try to get some facetime with someone at whatever level this is held up at. 

No prob on the vent...I did it many times when I was chasing my VOT trust me....

 

[TUNETOG]

I've learned to accept that no one in the CF is going to look after my personal interests better than I am. 

You should try to get some facetime with someone at whatever level this is held up at. 

No prob on the vent...I did it many times when I was chasing my VOT trust me....

I was able to find/view the SIP today. Things don't look too promising.  :facepalm: Can some of you folk do me a favor and retire/get promoted and open some cap space at the bottom.  :nod:

 

[TUNETOG]

Pinged off of a couple people who know people in the know, for the trade (make sense?). Have literally been told that my suspicions are correct.

DND in their infinite wisdom have made it easier for flat face, untrained, no background civi off the street to apply, process and get an offer in the trade far quicker/easier than anyone in Reg/ResF trying to CT. It would essentially be quicker to release and reapply. Though he stopped short of actually saying to do that. I agree, as I'm quite happy to have steady with benefits work in the meantime. But how this system seems like a good idea to anyone is beyond me. You have, at least, basic trained troops with varying levels/years of experience that just need to prove themselves in the trades training. Already in the system that know how the military works. Am I missing something here? ??? ??? ??? :facepalm:

 

[Eye In The Sky]

I don't know.  I won't comment because I don't know if what you were told was 'true' or 'who' said it.  Different people carry different...credibility.  Lots of people talk like they know the goods when they don't so...hard to offer an opinion on what is fact or otherwise.  But the SIP #s don't lie.

BTW...a lot of those "flat face civies" who were on the initial DE trial are now Cpl's in the Advanced Category and moving onto their 2nd tour.  I suspect you'll see the first of them promoted to MCpl in the next year if not sooner.  :2c:

Lots of people, in the past, who were VOTs, failed in Winnipeg.  Prior service may, or may not, give someone a 'leg up' in the AES OP trg system

Don't get me wrong, I feel your frustration.  VOT, OT or DE...there is no guarantee you will get offered a position in the trade and/or pass Winnipeg.  A lot of it is right time/right place/luck to get in the door.

Good luck!

 

[TUNETOG]

I don't know.  I won't comment because I don't know if what you were told was 'true' or 'who' said it.  Different people carry different...credibility.  Lots of people talk like they know the goods when they don't so...hard to offer an opinion on what is fact or otherwise.  But the SIP #s don't lie.

BTW...a lot of those "flat face civies" who were on the initial DE trial are now Cpl's in the Advanced Category and moving onto their 2nd tour.  I suspect you'll see the first of them promoted to MCpl in the next year if not sooner.  :2c:

Lots of people, in the past, who were VOTs, failed in Winnipeg.  Prior service may, or may not, give someone a 'leg up' in the AES OP trg system

Don't get me wrong, I feel your frustration.  VOT, OT or DE...there is no guarantee you will get offered a position in the trade and/or pass Winnipeg.  A lot of it is right time/right place/luck to get in the door.

Good luck!

I hear you. And I understand they are no longer civies. They've put in their time, and are now tried and tested. My point is just, it doesn't seem those of us already in the system get the same considertation as what amounts to a "new guy". We will all have to do the same training in the end I guess. I figured we might have a chance to get first kick of the can.

As for my "sources". They are very reliable. Again, there's no way to for me to prove that, or for you to know it, so it's kind of moot point. As you say the SIP #'s are accurate. I guess the silver lining is that the trade is healthy because people want to be there. Maybe I can be one of the lucky "ones"....literally.

 

[DAA]

Regretably, that is just the way the current system works.  One would think, that if the CF wanted to fill it's Regular Force ranks, that it would draw from the Primary Reserve people who have already been screened/processed by the Recruiting System, successfully completed their BMQ/BMOQ, successfully completed their occupation training and thus have a reasonable track record with the CF.  It saves in both training time and $$$.

But on the other side of the coin, Reserve Force units just don't like losing their trained personnel, expecially after they have spent their own time and resources on getting their people to the functional stage.  At the end of the day, by doing a CT from the Res F to the Reg F in turn only puts a greater demand on Res F recruiting, as they now have to replace and retrain a hard to come by body.

So there is no real solution to the issue.

 

[TUNETOG]

Regretably, that is just the way the current system works.  One would think, that if the CF wanted to fill it's Regular Force ranks, that it would draw from the Primary Reserve people who have already been screened/processed by the Recruiting System, successfully completed their BMQ/BMOQ, successfully completed their occupation training and thus have a reasonable track record with the CF.  It saves in both training time and $$$.

But on the other side of the coin, Reserve Force units just don't like losing their trained personnel, expecially after they have spent their own time and resources on getting their people to the functional stage.  At the end of the day, by doing a CT from the Res F to the Reg F in turn only puts a greater demand on Res F recruiting, as they now have to replace and retrain a hard to come by body.

So there is no real solution to the issue.

In a general sense that is def. true and makes a good point. However, I am and have been filling a full-time class B pos. from  the start of my reserve time. I have no requirement to parade on a regular basis as my current position is operational. All of my training, less one course was in the RegF. All of that doesn't matter, and makes no change to my situation, or the process/situation as a whole. I am not special.

 

[DAA]

In a general sense that is def. true and makes a good point. However, I am and have been filling a full-time class B pos. from  the start of my reserve time. I have no requirement to parade on a regular basis as my current position is operational. All of my training, less one course was in the RegF. All of that doesn't matter, and makes no change to my situation, or the process/situation as a whole. I am not special.

My only suggestion........

You already have a full-time Class B posn and your CT Application is already in.  So keep doing what you're doing, add on to your quals as best you can and keep pursuing your CT aspirations.  I can't see many people wanting to CT from the Res to Reg every year for AES Op, so one day your number may get called.

 

[Eye In The Sky]

As for my "sources". They are very reliable. Again, there's no way to for me to prove that, or for you to know it, so it's kind of moot point.

Sure there is; PM me a name.   

 

[peterpan]

Beck...whats even worse is when something goes wrong on your finale phase of training ( Otu/ moat) and they need to send you to a different platform...so you get stuck in limbo for over a year and counting!!  Oh fun times indeed...but eye in the sky can vouch for that...lol