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Traditions. Bottom up or top down

So the whole concept of tradition is deeply rooted in one's culture; be it Ethnic, spiritual, professional, social, or any other thing within humanity that groups humans together with other like humans.

Each subculture is shaped, not only by their commonalities in appearance, profession, identity, or belief; but by agreed upon behaviours within the group based on shared values. It's why every sport we play on earth has a rulebook. These societal norms govern each sub sect and often become codified either in regulations, but often times instead we see groups defining a social norm by either mimicking it or shunning it. That is in turn passed down through generations etc. This has been observed across the animal kingdom.

In this context, every subdivision within the bigger CAF has societal norms that are unique from each other. Passing the port is an easy one to use as an example. Some behavioral norms are formed either top down or bottom up, and it depends on if it's a regulated norm or just a "done thing" norm.

Where things get interesting is when the tradition formed out of a previous societal norm come into conflict with newer refined societal norms. Watch an episode of Friends with someone from Gen Z and see how few of the jokes land with them. It's not that they have no sense of humour, it's that the acceptable attitudes and behaviours have evolved and changed as a society.

Same thing with some of our societal norms within the CAF. I can easily see smoke pits going the way of the dodo in 20 years because smokers are starting to become fewer and farther between. It's why mess culture is on the decline, because greater societal norms have changed around alcohol.

That's where the friction point is WRT traditions in the CAF right now. We are at a crossroads where the greater society we all come from and are representing has changed certain norms and we haven't adapted to meet those. Some of them are traditions that we ourselves need to do a better job of socializing and reinforcing to newcomers to the tribe. In any case, since societal norms are very much living and adaptable concepts, so too do our traditions. Hence why BEARD/BOOT/HAIR/WEEDFORGEN hit differently across various subcultures within the CAF and veteran communities.

What we need to do as a CAF is take a holistic look at our traditions, codified or just accepted ones, and do some honest reflection and triage. Firstly, the tradition needs to be compared to the greater Canadian societal norms and the question should be "how far out of step are we?" Then, there needs to be a triage done for the following three things:

-Is the tradition still acceptable and relevant to both greater Canadian society and the CAF?

-Is the tradition more harmful than the loss of the tradition the societal norms? And

-Is the tradition adaptable in its current form to eliminate or at least narrow the gap between the conflicting norms?

And ofciurse because the structure of the CAF is basically a million different cohorts grouped together, this isn't an easy endeavor. I saw someone mention saluting further up in the thread. Junior NCMs would have a different take than Snr NCOs and WOs, or than Officers. Then you get further down the granule between CA/RCN/RCAF, Field Force vs. HQ, Aircrew vs. Maint, Ship vs. Shore. Everyone is going to place certain value to the practice because of its impact on their day to day life and the norms of their subculture.

It's doesn't mean that having to pop a high five to a commissioned officer is an inherently bad or classist thing, it's an action and behaviour that doesn't harm the organization or its members. Where we have fallen down is communicating and socializing the reason for the custom. When there is a lack of cohesive understanding, there is assumption and animosity.

Now, trying to push a tradition top down can still be a tradition, if it has the buy in and reinforcement of the collective body. I could easily tell my troop that we're going to wear pink socks for PT and that's a new tradition, but if they don't like it.. you bet your ass when I get posted out they're going back to whatever socks they want. If they are on board and accepting off it, "Someone get the new Tp Comd a set of Pink socks... he's out of dress."

In the end, our culture and societal norms can and do change; and so should our traditions. That said, throwing the baby out with the bathwater is not the preferred method. The CAF being an organization as large and diverse as it is, you can harm one subsect by doing something that will benefit another. Where we have a benefit is that we can, in fact, regulate societal norms and mandate change. Even if it's unpopular at first, enforcement and great acceptance means those friction points are lessened and removed over time. I'm positive that there was a huge push back when smoking in the office was no longer a thing. I have yet to hear a complaint in 2023 about that.

Traditions are good, but they are living and breathing aspects of culture. If they're rigid and unbending, they will be broken and discarded eventually. Where we need to get better as an organization is the triage of these traditions and communicating why we're retaining, adapting, or discarding them.

That said, I have to run. I must sacrifice a Pig to Jimmy before the next full moon or my Crypto Fill will drop.
 
I don't consider saluting a superior officer a "tradition"...maybe I'm alone on this one.
It's a socialized pattern of behaviour that we have adopted and maintained for millenia. Custom, tradition, habit depending on if you're CA, RCN, or RCAF 😉
 
I think the issue is that the CAF tends to use 'tradition' as a club to bring things back in that have been dropped. Once something has been gone for 30-50 years, it's no longer a tradition, it's 'history'.

That comes across more as special interest groups who are out of touch with the CAF of today (cough RCL cough cough) with nostalgia creating extra, unecessary work/churn, and is always tone deaf in the roll out.
 
I guess the official march of the RCN is on the chopping block now, time to modernize I guess.330824464_1201324443846467_5699169850029833827_n.jpg
 
There is a writing campaign to CRCN about this. I doubt it will have any effect. His issue is with the words that actually talk about the conquest of New France.

My response? Change the words! We do that all the time. The tune is great and I doubt that 1 in 50 RCN pers knows the words anyway. I can guarantee that what ever tune they come up with will be bland as wet toast.
 
There is a writing campaign to CRCN about this. I doubt it will have any effect. His issue is with the words that actually talk about the conquest of New France.

My response? Change the words! We do that all the time. The tune is great and I doubt that 1 in 50 RCN pers knows the words anyway. I can guarantee that what ever tune they come up with will be bland as wet toast.
I don't see New France or even France mentioned in Heart of Oak's lyrics...maybe I misunderstood your post
 
The first verse:
Come cheer up, my lads! 'tis to glory we steer,
To add something more to this wonderful year;
To honour we call you, as free men not slaves,
For who are so free as the sons of the waves?


The "wonderful year" referenced in the first verse is 1759-60, during which British forces were victorious in several significant battles: the Battle of Lagos on August 19, 1759, the battle of Quebec City (better known as The Plains of Abraham) on September 13, 1759 and the battle of Quiberon Bay on 20 November 1759. These were followed a few months later by the Battle of Wandiwash in India on 22 January 1760.
 
There is a writing campaign to CRCN about this. I doubt it will have any effect. His issue is with the words that actually talk about the conquest of New France.
The one verse that gets played doesn't have that connection...right? Singing it in my head now

Passing the port is an easy one to use as an example
Your post was great, but this point really made me think. Just try to explain to a civilian with zero concept of the CAF (assume all they know is from Hollywood) that each service does different things to a port bottle at a specific point of a dinner. More likely than not, their expression would be either bemusement or confusion.

But, the thing is that when we're new to the military, stuff like this is less "weird" when everything is weird. In the Navy, calling things different names (deckhead, ladder, and heads instead of ceiling, stairs, and washroom), 1000 soup, the watch system, are completely foreign concepts to most people.

Maybe the way to gauge tradition is to revisit it regularly when folks are about 5-10 years in. Keep the staff effort and money arguments out of it - does it still make sense as a concept? Those are the folks that may stay a further 15 years and will have to live with the decisions, not the senior folks with one foot out the retirement door already.
 
There is a writing campaign to CRCN about this. I doubt it will have any effect. His issue is with the words that actually talk about the conquest of New France.

My response? Change the words! We do that all the time. The tune is great and I doubt that 1 in 50 RCN pers knows the words anyway. I can guarantee that what ever tune they come up with will be bland as wet toast.

So I guess "Vive la canadienne!" And "Ça Ira" are next? No? Then STFU and get over it
 
The first verse:
Come cheer up, my lads! 'tis to glory we steer,
To add something more to this wonderful year;
To honour we call you, as free men not slaves,
For who are so free as the sons of the waves?


The "wonderful year" referenced in the first verse is 1759-60, during which British forces were victorious in several significant battles: the Battle of Lagos on August 19, 1759, the battle of Quebec City (better known as The Plains of Abraham) on September 13, 1759 and the battle of Quiberon Bay on 20 November 1759. These were followed a few months later by the Battle of Wandiwash in India on 22 January 1760.
So now historical facts are offensive...got it...lol
 
When I did my JLC back in 1994, when we went out into the field to do our tasks, we had to sing "Heart of Oak" as we marched out. Not one Francophone complained...lol
 
come on. We all know that change must happen for the sake of change.
 
More of a "jig" than a march, but a possible candidate.

 
When I did my JLC back in 1994, when we went out into the field to do our tasks, we had to sing "Heart of Oak" as we marched out. Not one Francophone complained...lol
Openly.

Now, it's possible that they didn't complain, but it's also totally possible that they were complaining in private.
 
You likely heard it from me😉. Honed my skills on the open pilotages. Fantastic on a warm sunny day. The depths of hell during cold and rainy watches.
In ‘89 or ‘90 as a young killick Cert 2, I visited Fundy’s bridge before going on watch. It was a cold and blustery day. Sandy Bellows was the CO and archetypical ”Old man and the Sea” while the OOW was a young Brian Santarpia who was five shades of green and puking over the side.
 
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