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The Great Gun Control Debate- 2.0

KevinB said:
I’m having a tough time believing that any significant amount of children are traumatized by LE in Canada.
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Ah. This was in relation to news stories about "woke" young Americans demanding LE LOs be removed from American schools.
 
Lumber said:
That's not the point. The point is you don't call those vets "traumatized lambs" and tell them that they should just go enjoy the fireworks as the solution to getting over their PTSD, same as it makes no sense to tell children who have been traumatized by police that the way to get over their trauma is to suck it up and go hug a cop.
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Nobody called Veterans anything. My response, was to your assertion that the sight of cops triggers people, to the point of fear and escape.
Lumber said:
"traumatized lambs"? That's immensely disrespectful, and clearly shows you have no fucking clue what you are talking about when it comes to mental health and care for those dealing with trauma. You have no idea what it does to these young kids to see their fathers shot dead by police for seemingly no reason.

There are neighborhoods in Canada where I've seen signs put up around Canada day (and some other holidays) that say something to the effect that "combat veterans live around hear, fireworks can trigger their PTSD, please reconsider the use of fireworks." I guess since "sunlight and exposure" the way to deal with this, then these "traumatized lambs" should just suck it up and enjoy the fireworks, right?
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Quit being so sanctimonious. You've switched from kids in school, being triggered at the sight of RSO's to Veterans being afraid of fireworks. You're all over the board. Quit throwing out shit and try bend it to your narrative. You don't know the first thing about me.
Lumber said:
Ah. This was in relation to news stories about "woke" young Americans demanding LE LOs be removed from American schools.
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The same one I responded to, until you decided it didn't fit your narrative and somehow switched to Veterans and fireworks in the same breath. Your concerns have been previously discussed in other threadss. I suggest you seek solace there.

This thread is for Gun Control.

Can a mod clean this tangent out and put it where it belongs?
 
Fishbone Jones said:
Nobody called Veterans anything. My response, was to your assertion that the sight of cops triggers people, to the point of fear and escape.

Quit being so sanctimonious. You've switched from kids in school, being triggered at the sight of RSO's to Veterans being afraid of fireworks. You're all over the board. Quit throwing out shit and try bend it to your narrative. You don't know the first thing about me.
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I really don't understand how you can't see the comparison, so I'll try and bring it all into one post.

I brought up the example of children suffering from PTSD because they had witnessed their fathers gunned down by police in one of the numerous cases of excessive use of force in the states. I opined that the sight of police in their school would trigger their PTSD.

Instead of accepting that these children actually have PTSD and that the sight of police would trigger their PTSD symptoms, you referred to these children as "traumatized lambs" and said that instead of shielding them things that might trigger their PTSD symptoms and exacerbate their trauma, that they should instead embrace the police as a way of getting over their trauma and building a better community.

Now, since I know that forcing people to suffer through situations that exacerbate their PTSD symptoms is not the way to address PTSD, I can only infer that either a. you don't know how PTSD should be dealt with or, b. you don't believe that these kids actually have PTSD from their parents being shot by police (or both).

So, this being a military forum, I brought in a more familiar example of veterans suffering from PTSD and how they should be treated. My hope was that a more familiar context would help you see the similarity between these two situations, and therefore would understand that your idea behind how children suffering from police-related PTSD should be dealt with, and how you should not refer to them as "traumatized lambs".
 
QV said:
If your kids are scared of the cops, you're parenting wrong.
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Really? Is that seriously your universal belief? That there no situations where children witnessed police using excessive force, exceeding their mandate, or flat out breaking the law, leading the children to develop a fear and distrust of the police? It's all just "bad parenting"?
 
Lumber said:
I really don't understand how you can't see the comparison, so I'll try and bring it all into one post.

I brought up the example of children suffering from PTSD because they had witnessed their fathers gunned down by police in one of the numerous cases of excessive use of force in the states. I opined that the sight of police in their school would trigger their PTSD.

Instead of accepting that these children actually have PTSD and that the sight of police would trigger their PTSD symptoms, you referred to these children as "traumatized lambs" and said that instead of shielding them things that might trigger their PTSD symptoms and exacerbate their trauma, that they should instead embrace the police as a way of getting over their trauma and building a better community.

Now, since I know that forcing people to suffer through situations that exacerbate their PTSD symptoms is not the way to address PTSD, I can only infer that either a. you don't know how PTSD should be dealt with or, b. you don't believe that these kids actually have PTSD from their parents being shot by police (or both).

So, this being a military forum, I brought in a more familiar example of veterans suffering from PTSD and how they should be treated. My hope was that a more familiar context would help you see the similarity between these two situations, and therefore would understand that your idea behind how children suffering from police-related PTSD should be dealt with, and how you should not refer to them as "traumatized lambs".
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Back your truck up buckwheat.

Like I said earlier, you don't have a schmick who I am.

I have been diagnosed with PTSD due to my military service. Do not presume I'm ignorant of the facts and that your weekend, amatuer psychiatric gig, here, doesn't qualify you to diagnose, determine, decide, speak for, or push your platitudes. Especially since those of us affected never asked for your opinion on our problems.

You should stick to what you know.

I like fireworks.
 
Fishbone Jones said:
Back your truck up buckwheat.

Like I said earlier, you don't have a schmick who I am.

I have been diagnosed with PTSD due to my military service. Do not presume I'm ignorant of the facts and that your weekend, amatuer psychiatric gig, here, doesn't qualify you to diagnose, determine, decide, speak for, or push your platitudes. Especially since those of us affected never asked for your opinion on our problems.

You should stick to what you know.

I like fireworks.
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If you actually have PTSD and know what it feels like, then you should be absolutely ashamed of yourself for referring to others suffering from PTSD as "traumatized lambs".
 
Lumber said:
The person who said this is from a radical-right Islamophobic anti-vax populist party within Germany, but I don't suppose any of those things will dissuade you from lending credence to what she said.



You skipped the first part of what he said. The guy who said this also said Trudeau’s government is a “dictatorship of the worst kind.” If you actualyl believe that describing the current government of Canada as a "dictatorship" is anything close to the truth, then you are either a. ignorant of what the a dictatorship actually is, or b. being obtuse for the sake of feeding your base. Either way, once this guy that this, then there's no longer any point in lending weight to whatever comes
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I'm sure you left out a couple of descriptors there sunshine. Try concentrate on what the MEP members had to say.
Lumber said:
If you actually have PTSD and know what it feels like, then you should be absolutely ashamed of yourself for referring to others suffering from PTSD as "traumatized lambs".
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Again, Mr Weekend Doctor enters the chat, with his psuedo diagnoses. You are the ignorant shit who needs to delve into cause and effects. Do not ever, presume to know what my physical and mental problems are and how they manifest themselves. Sanctimonious, ignorant and utterly wrong. Your useless, hyperbolic messaging is no more than a manifestation of your out of touch reality. In the interest of trying to put this thread back on track about Gun Control, I'm going to ignore your wrong, useless opinion of my condition, your self inflated import on the subject, your diagnoses without education, professional status or knowledge. In short, you are nothing more than an internet guy with an useless, conflated opinion that requires no more of my time.
 
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Fishbone Jones said:
I'm sure you left out a couple of descriptors there sunshine. Try concentrate on what the MEP members had to say.

Again, Mr Weekend Doctor enters the chat, with his psuedo diagnoses. You are the ignorant shit who needs to delve into cause and effects. Do not ever, presume to know what my physical and mental problems are and how they manifest themselves. Sanctimonious, ignorant and utterly wrong. Your useless, hyperbolic messaging is no more than a manifestation of your out of touch reality. In the interest of trying to put this thread back on track about Gun Control, I'm going to ignore your wrong, useless opinion of my condition, your self inflated import on the subject, your diagnoses without education, professional status or knowledge. In short, you are nothing more than an internet guy with an useless, conflated opinion that requires no more of my time.
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I'm pretty sure didn't say anything about your diagnosis? I simply derided your negative and hurtful stance toward those who appear to have, from your apparent point of view, a "lesser" form of PTSD, and said that it was an especially abhorrent position considering you should know exactly what they are going through.

But I agree we've belabored the point and neither of us is going to soon change our opinion of the other.

Back on track, I was watching some youtube last night, and I was surprised to discover that Florida is one of the few states that does not allow open carry.
 
Large parts of the community have complicated relationships with uniforms. It’s a complex issue- with a part of it being the day to day poisoning at home by parents towards police or authority etc.and then the idea that the only time they see cops it’s them arresting family or during the worst day of their lives.

It’s complex. I don’t think The answer is not having police seen. That makes them the boogeyman. But it’s something that seems to be the idea dujour

I also recognize and see kids afraid of police. I had a young one wet themselves when they saw me. It’s a real thing. The catalyst for the fear is debatable.
 
Booter said:
I had a young one wet themselves when they saw me. It’s a real thing. The catalyst for the fear is debatable.
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It's not debatable; that poor little lamb just isn't being parented right.
 
Halifax Tar said:
If that poor little lamb is scared of police because mommy and daddy are criminals then you're right they aren't being parented right.
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Absolutely! No argument there. I don't take issue with the specific idea, but the declaration that it is the sole reason possible.
 
Jarnhamar said:
Hopefully police in Ontario refuse to support Trudeau confiscating long guns. I'd hate for this to be me or one of my family members.

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What ever happened to that LEO ?

Lumber said:
Absolutely! No argument there. I don't take issue with the specific idea, but the declaration that it is the sole reason possible.
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Yes, yes there is always the exception to the rule.
 
Jarnhamar said:
Hopefully police in Ontario refuse to support Trudeau confiscating long guns.
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There is an ongoing letter writing campaign in Ontario to sway the Ford government to follow the examples of AB, MB, SK and NB.

However, the centre of the universe (the GTA) supports the ban, the confiscation regime - with or without compensation - and the upcoming elimination of lawful handgun ownership. I believe the Ford government will cave to public pressure in the GTA and join BC and QC in implementing Trudeau's plan.
 
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